Author Topic: Lyle's Golden Syrup  (Read 2721 times)

Offline brewthru

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #15 on: February 23, 2020, 03:33:00 pm »
Keep in mind your yeast choice when using invert brewing syrups.

Yeast = Wyeast 1968

Offline brewthru

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2020, 03:37:05 pm »
So, Lyles is not invert? I was just reading about sugars to add to a bitter. I went with table sugar but thought I should get some Lyles next time.

Golden syrup is a roughly 2:1 blend of lightly caramelised invert and non-invert sugar. I shared a video from Ragus about its production here : https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/golden-syrup.655474/

It was widely promoted by some of the early British homebrew writers not as The One True Substitute for invert, but as a readily-available "hack" that at least was closer to invert than white sugar. Since syrup can be found in any British kitchen and is literally sold side-by-side with sugar in any British supermarket, those old writers were simply saying "since you have the choice when shopping in the UK, buy this rather than white sugar, it's a bit closer to what really gets used". However the hacks intended for a local audience then transmute into gospel when they go overseas...

Syrup does have a distinctive taste, although it's delicate enough that it would be swamped by the buckets of crystal that US brewers seem obsessed with putting in British styles.

I see lots of AIH (aka homebrewing.org) recipes call for Lyle's Golden Syrup. Substitute for an all grain brewer?

Well those recipes are trying to emulate the kind of recipes used by the big British commercial brewers in the mid-20th century, who were not all-grain brewers. However that has changed a bit - under pressure from CAMRA some have moved from using adjuncts in everything to saving them for speciality brews, and it's benefited the beers. But 10-15% brewing sugar is pretty "traditional" in 20th century British commercial brewing.

So to that extent, you just drop it and replace with more base malt. But bear in mind that sugars act as "anti-crystal" to some extent, so if you lose the sugar then you want to reduce the amount of crystal as well. For instance, Fuller's are now all-grain on their main partigyle that makes Pride, ESB etc and use 7.2% light crystal, which is about as much as I'd want without any sugar to balance it; conversely the famous Boddington's of the 1970s was about 10% adjunct with zero crystal. That gives you an idea of the extremes, but a good rule of thumb when you're starting out is to use as much sugar as crystal and then adjust to taste. But these US recipes that have 10+% of crystal in bitter are just nonsensical.
Wow! Great info. Thanks for the input.

Offline mchrispen

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #17 on: February 23, 2020, 04:19:05 pm »
RE: London ESB, from Lallemond:


Maltotriose is present in wort in an average 10-15% of all malt worts. The result will be fuller  body and residual sweetness in beer. Be advised to adjust gravities and mash temperatures according to desired result.
[/size]
[/size]I am not sure that the Wyeast is the identical product, but their description includes low attenuation.
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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #18 on: February 23, 2020, 04:22:36 pm »
RE: London ESB, from Lallemond:


Maltotriose is present in wort in an average 10-15% of all malt worts. The result will be fuller  body and residual sweetness in beer. Be advised to adjust gravities and mash temperatures according to desired result.
[/size]
[/size]I am not sure that the Wyeast is the identical product, but their description includes low attenuation.

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Offline Robert

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #19 on: February 23, 2020, 06:06:06 pm »
If you really want Lyles Golden Syrup, it will be easier just to buy it.  If you want one of the numbered brewers invert sugars, then you'll want to make it.  There have been threads devoted to this if you search the forum.
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Offline raf

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #20 on: March 24, 2020, 02:15:39 pm »
I've found a few DIY recipes on the net. Conflicting opinions. Does anyone have a recommended recipe for making my own Lyle's Golden Syrup?

Here's a good resource: http://www.unholymess.com/blog/beer-brewing-info/making-brewers-invert/comment-page-1

As mentioned earlier in this thread, Lyle's is only partially inverted. But you could make true #1 invert if you're looking for something light.

Offline coonmanxdog

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #21 on: March 29, 2020, 01:22:39 pm »
I recently used some Lyle's in an Old Peculiar clone that I did. Came out great. That recipe also had brown sugar and some light Belgian candy sugar in it as well.

Offline brewthru

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #22 on: October 14, 2021, 11:31:38 am »
I've found a few DIY recipes on the net. Conflicting opinions. Does anyone have a recommended recipe for making my own Lyle's Golden Syrup?

Here's a good resource: http://www.unholymess.com/blog/beer-brewing-info/making-brewers-invert/comment-page-1

As mentioned earlier in this thread, Lyle's is only partially inverted. But you could make true #1 invert if you're looking for something light.

Unfortunately, Hmm. We’re having trouble finding that site.

We can’t connect to the server at www.unholymess.com.

Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #23 on: October 14, 2021, 11:49:52 am »
I've found a few DIY recipes on the net. Conflicting opinions. Does anyone have a recommended recipe for making my own Lyle's Golden Syrup?

Here's a good resource: http://www.unholymess.com/blog/beer-brewing-info/making-brewers-invert/comment-page-1

As mentioned earlier in this thread, Lyle's is only partially inverted. But you could make true #1 invert if you're looking for something light.

Unfortunately, Hmm. We’re having trouble finding that site.

We can’t connect to the server at www.unholymess.com.

I think it is down.
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Offline BrewBama

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #24 on: October 14, 2021, 12:56:15 pm »
I tried it not long ago and agree. It was a great resource but it seems to be gone now.



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Offline Big_Eight

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #25 on: October 14, 2021, 01:48:15 pm »
It's easy to make as mentioned I recently made some #2 and am using it in an old bodds recipe.

They also sell it at AIH
« Last Edit: October 14, 2021, 01:50:18 pm by Big_Eight »

Offline brewthru

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #26 on: October 14, 2021, 02:19:44 pm »
I've found a few DIY recipes on the net. Conflicting opinions. Does anyone have a recommended recipe for making my own Lyle's Golden Syrup?

Here's a good resource: http://www.unholymess.com/blog/beer-brewing-info/making-brewers-invert/comment-page-1

As mentioned earlier in this thread, Lyle's is only partially inverted. But you could make true #1 invert if you're looking for something light.

Unfortunately, Hmm. We’re having trouble finding that site.

We can’t connect to the server at www.unholymess.com.

I think it is down.

Yes, down. Unsure if permanent or not. I know the post is old.  Was hoping for info on a DIY golden syrup recipe.

Offline ynotbrusum

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #27 on: October 14, 2021, 03:01:56 pm »
I know that there was a thread here that talked about invert syrup extensively...give it a search.

Here you go: https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?action=search2

Cheers!
« Last Edit: October 14, 2021, 03:03:57 pm by ynotbrusum »
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Offline Big_Eight

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #28 on: October 14, 2021, 04:38:09 pm »
1 pint of water to 1 lb of pure cane sugar I use the raw cane sugar from the grocery store.

Bring water to boil  turn off heat and mix in sugar.

Add 1/4 teaspoon of citric acid per pound of sugar

Put in candy thermometer and heat to 240°F (115.6°C)

Maintain heat between 240 - 250°F (115.6 - 121.1°C)

For #1 hold temp for 20-30 minutes for #2 90-120 minutes.

Here's a HBTALK thread where they talk about making it. The thread appears to have some recipe info from the unholymess website.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2021, 04:56:47 pm by Big_Eight »

Offline brewthru

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Re: Lyle's Golden Syrup
« Reply #29 on: October 14, 2021, 05:20:04 pm »
1 pint of water to 1 lb of pure cane sugar I use the raw cane sugar from the grocery store.

Bring water to boil  turn off heat and mix in sugar.

Add 1/4 teaspoon of citric acid per pound of sugar

Put in candy thermometer and heat to 240°F (115.6°C)

Maintain heat between 240 - 250°F (115.6 - 121.1°C)

For #1 hold temp for 20-30 minutes for #2 90-120 minutes.

Here's a HBTALK thread where they talk about making it. The thread appears to have some recipe info from the unholymess website.

You de Man! Thanks!