Author Topic: Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers  (Read 787 times)

Offline Nagel Family Brewing

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Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers
« on: September 18, 2010, 09:20:07 AM »
In my hoppy beers I am getting a sweetart flavor that I don't taste in commerical beers.  I brew 5 gallon batches and have been using 2-4 oz of american citrusy hops at flameout.  Cascade, Amarillo, Columbus, Ahtanum, Centennial, Simcoe.  Am I using too many hops, is this yeast bite, something else????

I usually do 2 to 3 weeks in primary and keg.  I use a cooler and frozen water bottles to keep ferments below 70.  I use 001 or 1056.  I pitch two yeast packs and my OG is between 1.056 and 1.066.

Offline Malticulous

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Re: Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers
« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2010, 08:52:19 PM »
I get tart from US-05 but at temps about 10 degrees cooler than that.

Offline tschmidlin

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Re: Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers
« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2010, 10:47:38 AM »
I've tasted this a lot when judging homebrew, and always chalked it up to an over abundance of flavor hops that aren't balanced by the malt.  If there's another cause, I'd love to know what it is.  Maybe Gordon has an idea . . .
Tom Schmidlin

Offline euge

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Re: Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers
« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2010, 11:23:58 AM »
I think you are using too much high alpha at flameout.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. -Richard P. Feynman

Offline gordonstrong

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Re: Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2010, 08:13:46 AM »
Not sure which specific flavor you mean.  "Tart" can cover a wide range.  I just don't know what you mean by "sweetart".  Like the candy?  I guess I'd have to taste it to know exactly what you meant.

In hoppy beers (commercial ones too), I often get an unpleasant acidity that I assume is coming from the hops.  I haven't measured the pH of those beers, but I wonder if sheer hop mass is causing a pH drop.  Again, I have no basis for this other than assuming that alpha acids in hops are actually acids that do cause a pH shift if you use enough of them.

I do a lot of late hop addition beers and don't generally have that problem. I also use a lot of the same hops as the OP.  I wonder if water chemistry has something to do with it.  I use RO water and don't mess with it much.

Check your pH at a few different points and see if it looks odd.  I'd be interested in knowing what the pH is of your finished beer that has that flavor.  De-gas it, and measure it at 68F.
Gordon Strong • Beavercreek, Ohio • AHA Member since 1997 • Twitter: GordonStrong

Offline tschmidlin

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Re: Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2010, 08:37:24 AM »
I just don't know what you mean by "sweetart".  Like the candy?
I don't know if that's what the OP meant, but yes, just like the candy.  I've only ever gotten it in beers that were supposed to be really hoppy, IPAs, pale ales, and the like.  Very strange.
Tom Schmidlin

Offline Nagel Family Brewing

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Re: Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2010, 12:13:02 PM »
Yeah, like the candy.  I will have to start checking ph.  I have never checked before.

Offline euge

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Re: Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers
« Reply #7 on: September 25, 2010, 12:12:26 AM »
I'm drinking a Deschutes Brewery Mirror Pond Pale ale. Candy sweet-tart is applicable. Maybe your palate is just seeing the more upfront fresh hop character that commercial beers lack.
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. -Richard P. Feynman

Offline tschmidlin

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Re: Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers
« Reply #8 on: September 25, 2010, 12:22:52 AM »
Nah.  I have had many (many (many!)) Mirror Ponds.  Not sweet tarty the way I'm talking about.  Then again, the fact that your getting that in TX means that it could be a staling problem . . .or we're talking about different things.
Tom Schmidlin

Offline jeffy

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Re: Tart Flavor in Hoppy Beers
« Reply #9 on: September 25, 2010, 05:19:40 AM »
I also agree that there's nothing sweet tart in a fresh Mirror Pond Pale Ale.  Must be something else you're describing or perhaps an off sample.
Jeff Gladish, Tampa (989.3, 175.1 Apparent Rennarian)
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