[redrocker652002]

Greetings to all,

I am on vacation next week, and I am going to brew a few batches, well two actually cause that is the number of fermenters I have   LOL.  My question is this:  I got a recipe from a member here that was an extract version.  I would like to try the same recipe using all grain.  The recipe calls for 4.5 pounds of light DME and 2 pounds of Wheat DME.  What would I need in grain to make the equivalent?  Or am I simplifying this and will need more?  Any input would be most appreciated.

Also, it seems that the standard mash temp is about 152 to 155 for 60 minutes.  Would that be accurate?  It will be a 5 gallon batch, so I am going to put it in to Brewfather and see what amount of mash water and all that I need.   

Dino

[ScallyWag]

Most DME tends to be around 43 PPG, whereas light / pale all-grain tends to be around 35-38 PPG, so you need about 120% (+/-) as much grain poundage as the DME it calls for. 

For example, 4.5 pounds of DME would require about 5.2 to 5.4 pounds of all-grain malt to produce the same amount of sugars, +/-.

The wheat DME that I have used (Briess, I think) is 65% wheat, 35% pale or pils.  So 2 pounds of that DME would require about 24-25 oz of wheat malt and about 12-13 oz [more] of the pale malt in addition to the 5.2-5.4 pounds listed above (so, i.e., about 6 pounds total of pale, 1.5 pounds of wheat).

Mashing that high might get you a bit less fermentable sugars, so my rough estimates above might undershoot it relative to DME.  I don't have much experience mashing that high, so hopefully a more experienced brewer can adjust what I've said here.

[denny]

Most DME tends to be around 43 PPG, whereas light / pale all-grain tends to be around 35-38 PPG, so you need about 120% (+/-) as much grain poundage as the DME it calls for. 

For example, 4.5 pounds of DME would require about 5.2 to 5.4 pounds of all-grain malt to produce the same amount of sugars, +/-.

The wheat DME that I have used (Briess, I think) is 65% wheat, 35% pale or pils.  So 2 pounds of that DME would require about 24-25 oz of wheat malt and about 12-13 oz [more] of the pale malt in addition to the 5.2-5.4 pounds listed above (so, i.e., about 6 pounds total of pale, 1.5 pounds of wheat).

Mashing that high might get you a bit less fermentable sugars, so my rough estimates above might undershoot it relative to DME.  I don't have much experience mashing that high, so hopefully a more experienced brewer can adjust what I've said here.

Your numbers don't account for efficiency in all grain.  At 75% efficiency you get more like 25 points from a pound of grain, not 35.

[ScallyWag]

Most DME tends to be around 43 PPG, whereas light / pale all-grain tends to be around 35-38 PPG, so you need about 120% (+/-) as much grain poundage as the DME it calls for. 

For example, 4.5 pounds of DME would require about 5.2 to 5.4 pounds of all-grain malt to produce the same amount of sugars, +/-.

The wheat DME that I have used (Briess, I think) is 65% wheat, 35% pale or pils.  So 2 pounds of that DME would require about 24-25 oz of wheat malt and about 12-13 oz [more] of the pale malt in addition to the 5.2-5.4 pounds listed above (so, i.e., about 6 pounds total of pale, 1.5 pounds of wheat).

Mashing that high might get you a bit less fermentable sugars, so my rough estimates above might undershoot it relative to DME.  I don't have much experience mashing that high, so hopefully a more experienced brewer can adjust what I've said here.

Your numbers don't account for efficiency in all grain.  At 75% efficiency you get more like 25 points from a pound of grain, not 35.

Thanks - that's important.  I was hoping someone could give him a more precise equivalency.  It's obviously not a 1-to-1 from DME to AG.

So, RedRocker, based on Denny's example, you may need close to a 1.6667x [<--edited] the poundage, not just 1.20x.   You'll get a better idea as you learn what efficiency you typically get when mashing all-grain. 

ETA:  If you're not sure, you could go with the higher amounts of AG (e.g., assume 1.7x the poundage) and then if your efficiency is better than expected, producing a higher OG than you wanted, you could dilute with some water at the beginning or end of boil.  I think it's easier to dilute down to a target OG than it is to bump it up if you're too low.  YMMV...

[ScallyWag]

3 lb DME (44 PPG) is roughly 5 lb grain (36 PPG) at 75% efficiency.

Thanks!  I was way off originally.  That's the point I was hoping to make for RR.

[redrocker652002]

Great info from all.  Thanks to all who posted.  Gonna do some math and see where I end up.  Or, I might contact the original person who gave me the recipe and see if they have an all grain version.  Either way, awesome responses from all.  I thank you all for your input. 

[Kevin]

Doesn't your software have a conversion feature?

[soymateofeo]

I'd try to recreate that in beersmith two ways and try to get them close.  somebody mentioned a conversion tool in beersmith. Is that a thing?

[Fire Rooster]

https://jaysbrewingblog.com/2011/11/17/lazy-chart-for-converting-dme-lme-grain/

Used this chart when I converted from LME, DME to all grain, it worked for me.

[Kevin]

I'd try to recreate that in beersmith two ways and try to get them close.  somebody mentioned a conversion tool in beersmith. Is that a thing?

Yes. Import or copy the extract recipe then click the "Convert" button.