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Author Topic: Dry Hopping in a keg  (Read 1162 times)

Offline redrocker652002

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Dry Hopping in a keg
« on: July 10, 2022, 08:21:34 am »
OK, so my latest brew is going to require dry hopping. I was going to use a mesh bag as I have done in the past, but I hung the bag on my faucet in the garage without thinking about it and I am seeing what is possibly a bit of a dark spot on the bag where is was sitting on the faucet. So, in my search for other ways of doing things, I remember reading about hopping in the keg. I see there are tubes you can buy that will allow you to drop them into the keg or just drop a bag in it with the string attached to the lid so it can be pulled out. My initial question is, do you leave the bag or tube in the keg after you carbonate? Or do you pull the bag out and then go thru the carb process and prepare to drink? My thought is that the hop bag or tube must have to come out, or the flavor of the dry hop will turn bad and ruin the beer. But I thought I would post it just for the heck of it. Thoughts? 

Also, my beer recipe says the fermenting process is 14 days total. I need to dry hop, and my plan was to wait until fermenting activity has slowed or stopped and add the whole cone hops in a bag for 4 or 5 days, pull and finish up the 14 days.  Does this sound about right?  Or should I wait the 14 days before doing the dry hops?  Is there any advantage or disadvantage to either?

Thanks guys. 

RR

Offline fredthecat

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Re: Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2022, 08:44:22 am »
im no expert on kegging, and i believe i've heard people here dryhopping in keg, but:

hop creep is an action where enzymes(?) in the hops causes a reactivation of fermentation post-packaging. it will result in higher CO2 levels than you expect. its manageable but not super easy.

people are generally advocating for shorter dryhop times than some older recipes out there might still suggest.  so dryhopping in the keg as you consume the beer over weeks or months might end up with problems.

i'd keep it simple and just dryhop in primary and keg the beer. i saw your recipe and it looks good and very hoppy.

Offline tommymorris

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Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2022, 08:46:10 am »
OK, so my latest brew is going to require dry hopping. I was going to use a mesh bag as I have done in the past, but I hung the bag on my faucet in the garage without thinking about it and I am seeing what is possibly a bit of a dark spot on the bag where is was sitting on the faucet. So, in my search for other ways of doing things, I remember reading about hopping in the keg. I see there are tubes you can buy that will allow you to drop them into the keg or just drop a bag in it with the string attached to the lid so it can be pulled out. My initial question is, do you leave the bag or tube in the keg after you carbonate? Or do you pull the bag out and then go thru the carb process and prepare to drink? My thought is that the hop bag or tube must have to come out, or the flavor of the dry hop will turn bad and ruin the beer. But I thought I would post it just for the heck of it. Thoughts? 

Also, my beer recipe says the fermenting process is 14 days total. I need to dry hop, and my plan was to wait until fermenting activity has slowed or stopped and add the whole cone hops in a bag for 4 or 5 days, pull and finish up the 14 days.  Does this sound about right?  Or should I wait the 14 days before doing the dry hops?  Is there any advantage or disadvantage to either?

Thanks guys. 

RR
Your ispindel will tell you when your fermentation is actually done. I use the 3 days at the same gravity rule of thumb with my Tilt and find that to be a great guideline for when I can keg. Most likely it will be done before 14 days. But, 14 days is a pretty good guess and there is definitely no harm in waiting longer.

Regarding dry hopping. First, you could hand wash and thoroughly rinse the dry hop bag that got stained. I am sure it would be fine.

I dry hop in the keg without removing the hops ever. I have a floating dip tube. I just dump the hops in. They drop to the bottom and stay there.

Regarding dry hopping in your fermenter, just wait until fermentation is complete or nearly complete and add the hop bag. If you time it right you can add it so that you never take the bag out. Just drain the beer off into the keg when it’s dry hopped the correct amount of time.

Denny dry hops 2-3 days at 35F. I’ve done that once and it is effective.

Other people dry hop when fermentation is nearing completion but not done. I have never tried that.

Others dry hop in the keg but remove the dry hops. That’s sounds close to Denny’s method above.  I have never done that either.

So, there are a million ways to do it. I’m sure you’ll get lots of opinions.

Prost
« Last Edit: July 10, 2022, 09:20:56 am by tommymorris »

Offline denny

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Re: Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #3 on: July 10, 2022, 09:06:35 am »
im no expert on kegging, and i believe i've heard people here dryhopping in keg, but:

hop creep is an action where enzymes(?) in the hops causes a reactivation of fermentation post-packaging. it will result in higher CO2 levels than you expect. its manageable but not super easy.

people are generally advocating for shorter dryhop times than some older recipes out there might still suggest.  so dryhopping in the keg as you consume the beer over weeks or months might end up with problems.

i'd keep it simple and just dryhop in primary and keg the beer. i saw your recipe and it looks good and very hoppy.

Shellhammer showed that hop creep only happens if you add more yeast.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline denny

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Re: Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2022, 09:08:06 am »
OK, so my latest brew is going to require dry hopping. I was going to use a mesh bag as I have done in the past, but I hung the bag on my faucet in the garage without thinking about it and I am seeing what is possibly a bit of a dark spot on the bag where is was sitting on the faucet. So, in my search for other ways of doing things, I remember reading about hopping in the keg. I see there are tubes you can buy that will allow you to drop them into the keg or just drop a bag in it with the string attached to the lid so it can be pulled out. My initial question is, do you leave the bag or tube in the keg after you carbonate? Or do you pull the bag out and then go thru the carb process and prepare to drink? My thought is that the hop bag or tube must have to come out, or the flavor of the dry hop will turn bad and ruin the beer. But I thought I would post it just for the heck of it. Thoughts? 

Also, my beer recipe says the fermenting process is 14 days total. I need to dry hop, and my plan was to wait until fermenting activity has slowed or stopped and add the whole cone hops in a bag for 4 or 5 days, pull and finish up the 14 days.  Does this sound about right?  Or should I wait the 14 days before doing the dry hops?  Is there any advantage or disadvantage to either?

Thanks guys. 

RR

I dry hopped in the keg for maybe10-15 years. Eventually I became dissatisfied with the result.  When I read about short cold dry hopping, I tried it. I haven't dry hopped in the keg since.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline fredthecat

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Re: Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2022, 09:15:42 am »
im no expert on kegging, and i believe i've heard people here dryhopping in keg, but:

hop creep is an action where enzymes(?) in the hops causes a reactivation of fermentation post-packaging. it will result in higher CO2 levels than you expect. its manageable but not super easy.

people are generally advocating for shorter dryhop times than some older recipes out there might still suggest.  so dryhopping in the keg as you consume the beer over weeks or months might end up with problems.

i'd keep it simple and just dryhop in primary and keg the beer. i saw your recipe and it looks good and very hoppy.

Shellhammer showed that hop creep only happens if you add more yeast.

i believe i had it just a few months ago in a dry hopped pale ale. definitely didn't add more yeast, but was reaching near-gusher levels of carbonation in the last few bottles. after 2 or 3 weeks the previously clear beer became hazy suggesting to me that fermentation had started again. there wasnt a sudden temperature increase in storage either.

Offline denny

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Re: Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2022, 09:37:52 am »
im no expert on kegging, and i believe i've heard people here dryhopping in keg, but:

hop creep is an action where enzymes(?) in the hops causes a reactivation of fermentation post-packaging. it will result in higher CO2 levels than you expect. its manageable but not super easy.

people are generally advocating for shorter dryhop times than some older recipes out there might still suggest.  so dryhopping in the keg as you consume the beer over weeks or months might end up with problems.

i'd keep it simple and just dryhop in primary and keg the beer. i saw your recipe and it looks good and very hoppy.

Shellhammer showed that hop creep only happens if you add more yeast.

i believe i had it just a few months ago in a dry hopped pale ale. definitely didn't add more yeast, but was reaching near-gusher levels of carbonation in the last few bottles. after 2 or 3 weeks the previously clear beer became hazy suggesting to me that fermentation had started again. there wasnt a sudden temperature increase in storage either.

It's possible, but I really doubt it based on the research I've read.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline denny

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Re: Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2022, 09:39:42 am »
im no expert on kegging, and i believe i've heard people here dryhopping in keg, but:

hop creep is an action where enzymes(?) in the hops causes a reactivation of fermentation post-packaging. it will result in higher CO2 levels than you expect. its manageable but not super easy.

people are generally advocating for shorter dryhop times than some older recipes out there might still suggest.  so dryhopping in the keg as you consume the beer over weeks or months might end up with problems.

i'd keep it simple and just dryhop in primary and keg the beer. i saw your recipe and it looks good and very hoppy.

Shellhammer showed that hop creep only happens if you add more yeast.

i believe i had it just a few months ago in a dry hopped pale ale. definitely didn't add more yeast, but was reaching near-gusher levels of carbonation in the last few bottles. after 2 or 3 weeks the previously clear beer became hazy suggesting to me that fermentation had started again. there wasnt a sudden temperature increase in storage either.

It's possible, but I really doubt it based on the research I've read. https://patspints.com/2019/01/16/the-surprising-science-of-dry-hopping-lessons-from-tom-shellhammer/
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline redrocker652002

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Re: Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2022, 01:10:25 pm »
Thanks for all the info.  I think, based on what I have done in the past, I am going to drop a bag in the primary.  It won't be at 34 degrees, so I might give it 4 to 5 days.  My thought is to time it so that it is 4 to 5 days away from kegging or bottling, that way I can clean and sanitize everything all at once.  All good info, thanks to all who took the time to post 

Rock on!!!!

RR

Offline fredthecat

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Re: Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2022, 02:01:40 pm »
im no expert on kegging, and i believe i've heard people here dryhopping in keg, but:

hop creep is an action where enzymes(?) in the hops causes a reactivation of fermentation post-packaging. it will result in higher CO2 levels than you expect. its manageable but not super easy.

people are generally advocating for shorter dryhop times than some older recipes out there might still suggest.  so dryhopping in the keg as you consume the beer over weeks or months might end up with problems.

i'd keep it simple and just dryhop in primary and keg the beer. i saw your recipe and it looks good and very hoppy.

Shellhammer showed that hop creep only happens if you add more yeast.

i believe i had it just a few months ago in a dry hopped pale ale. definitely didn't add more yeast, but was reaching near-gusher levels of carbonation in the last few bottles. after 2 or 3 weeks the previously clear beer became hazy suggesting to me that fermentation had started again. there wasnt a sudden temperature increase in storage either.

It's possible, but I really doubt it based on the research I've read. https://patspints.com/2019/01/16/the-surprising-science-of-dry-hopping-lessons-from-tom-shellhammer/

denny, did you read the study?

his method was using using coors banquet beer, adding hops, or adding hops+yeast.

so the beer itself would have no active yeast in it. it wouldnt be homebrewed beer at all.

so by the step of "adding yeast", he is making beer somewhat more comparable to what would be a homebrewed beer with living yeast in it, then adding hops.

hopcreep is real, this study does not simulate homebrewed beer and essentially confirms that hopcreep with living yeast is real.

i mean to clarify what i mean by "hop creep", i mean the degradation of remaining dextrins into fermentable sugars. so yes, naturally yeast is a factor in this because it is needed to consume the sugars, create CO2+diacetyl and make the hop creep effect noticeable.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2022, 02:03:31 pm by fredthecat »

Online BrewBama

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Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2022, 02:21:42 pm »
@fredthecat: do you think dry hopping at cold temps reduce the chance of the phenomenon?  (Dormant yeast)


*Disclaimer*: Any comment I add is simply the way I brew beer. There are certainly other ways that can be equally effective which other brewers may contribute. This is what I’ve found that works for me using my equipment and processes so I offer this for your consideration. YMMV
« Last Edit: July 10, 2022, 02:25:59 pm by BrewBama »

Offline denny

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Re: Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2022, 02:45:22 pm »
@fredthecat: do you think dry hopping at cold temps reduce the chance of the phenomenon?  (Dormant yeast)


*Disclaimer*: Any comment I add is simply the way I brew beer. There are certainly other ways that can be equally effective which other brewers may contribute. This is what I’ve found that works for me using my equipment and processes so I offer this for your consideration. YMMV

That has been postulated and seems likely.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline denny

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Re: Dry Hopping in a keg
« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2022, 02:52:02 pm »
im no expert on kegging, and i believe i've heard people here dryhopping in keg, but:

hop creep is an action where enzymes(?) in the hops causes a reactivation of fermentation post-packaging. it will result in higher CO2 levels than you expect. its manageable but not super easy.

people are generally advocating for shorter dryhop times than some older recipes out there might still suggest.  so dryhopping in the keg as you consume the beer over weeks or months might end up with problems.

i'd keep it simple and just dryhop in primary and keg the beer. i saw your recipe and it looks good and very hoppy.

Shellhammer showed that hop creep only happens if you add more yeast.

i believe i had it just a few months ago in a dry hopped pale ale. definitely didn't add more yeast, but was reaching near-gusher levels of carbonation in the last few bottles. after 2 or 3 weeks the previously clear beer became hazy suggesting to me that fermentation had started again. there wasnt a sudden temperature increase in storage either.

It's possible, but I really doubt it based on the research I've read. https://patspints.com/2019/01/16/the-surprising-science-of-dry-hopping-lessons-from-tom-shellhammer/

denny, did you read the study?

his method was using using coors banquet beer, adding hops, or adding hops+yeast.

so the beer itself would have no active yeast in it. it wouldnt be homebrewed beer at all.

so by the step of "adding yeast", he is making beer somewhat more comparable to what would be a homebrewed beer with living yeast in it, then adding hops.

hopcreep is real, this study does not simulate homebrewed beer and essentially confirms that hopcreep with living yeast is real.

i mean to clarify what i mean by "hop creep", i mean the degradation of remaining dextrins into fermentable sugars. so yes, naturally yeast is a factor in this because it is needed to consume the sugars, create CO2+diacetyl and make the hop creep effect noticeable.

Yeah, I read it. We dont know how much yeast he added and how that might compare with what's in homebrew. We also dont know what your beer would have been without the dry hops. There was no control. Perhaps it would have happened anyway. I still believe that hop creep almost never happens to homebrewers and that it's a convenient explanation for something else. This has been known for a very long time.  We covered it 6 years ago, based on an article from 1941 that cites even older research.  http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/j.2050-0416.1941.tb06070.x/abstract I'm not saying It can't or doesn't happen, but if it's that prevalent why don't more people see it? I heavily dry hop maybe 90% of the beers I make and I haven't seen it. Doesnt it seem like I should?
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell