Author Topic: Stale Grain?  (Read 351 times)

Offline Bel Air Brewing

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Stale Grain?
« on: July 19, 2022, 07:46:27 am »
Brewed up an Irish Red yesterday. The plan was to use some Weyermann Carared. It was sealed in a heavy weight plastic bag. Opened up the bag, and I noticed an off aroma.

It was exactly like stale peanuts. Or old, stale cooking oil.

This grain is about 1 year. old. First time I have had this happen. The grain still tastes fine, but has that "stale peanut" odor. So we decided to use it for bird feed.

We have other grains about the same age, still in the original packaging material from the malting company. They are all fine.

Is this common? Any one else have this happen?
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Offline denny

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2022, 08:31:30 am »
I have recently used 9 year old pils malt that may have been past it's prime, but still made a great beer with no malt repeated off flavors. OTOH, I have had somewhat that has been dump3d due to being too old. I decide on a case by case basis by chewing some. If it's soft or tastes off, I dump it.
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Offline Bel Air Brewing

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2022, 08:38:46 am »
I have recently used 9 year old pils malt that may have been past it's prime, but still made a great beer with no malt repeated off flavors. OTOH, I have had somewhat that has been dump3d due to being too old. I decide on a case by case basis by chewing some. If it's soft or tastes off, I dump it.

This Carared is still firm, crunchy. Taste is fine. Just that slight stale peanut aroma.
Maybe it's Ok?
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Offline chinaski

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2022, 09:44:02 am »
What does it smell like when its fresh?  That's what you need to know in this case I think.

Offline Bel Air Brewing

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2022, 12:14:40 pm »
What does it smell like when its fresh?  That's what you need to know in this case I think.

Don't recall much if any aroma when fresh.
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Offline denny

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2022, 01:08:55 pm »
I have recently used 9 year old pils malt that may have been past it's prime, but still made a great beer with no malt repeated off flavors. OTOH, I have had somewhat that has been dump3d due to being too old. I decide on a case by case basis by chewing some. If it's soft or tastes off, I dump it.

This Carared is still firm, crunchy. Taste is fine. Just that slight stale peanut aroma.
Maybe it's Ok?

If it's crunchy and tastes OK, I'd say it's fine.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline Bel Air Brewing

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2022, 01:20:38 pm »
I have recently used 9 year old pils malt that may have been past it's prime, but still made a great beer with no malt repeated off flavors. OTOH, I have had somewhat that has been dump3d due to being too old. I decide on a case by case basis by chewing some. If it's soft or tastes off, I dump it.

This Carared is still firm, crunchy. Taste is fine. Just that slight stale peanut aroma.
Maybe it's Ok?

If it's crunchy and tastes OK, I'd say it's fine.

Thanks! I will use it next time.
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Offline brewthru

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2022, 06:21:10 am »
Sounds to me the heavy weight plastic bag allowed oxygen inside thereby causing the stale malt. May want to consider getting some food grade buckets with decent lids for malt storage especially since it's unknown what chemicals were used to make the heavy weight plastic bag. Was the heavy weight plastic bag food grade?

BTW, if the malt is stale you'll know it. Ever had a stale cracker or pretzel?

Offline denny

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2022, 08:09:55 am »
Sounds to me the heavy weight plastic bag allowed oxygen inside thereby causing the stale malt. May want to consider getting some food grade buckets with decent lids for malt storage especially since it's unknown what chemicals were used to make the heavy weight plastic bag. Was the heavy weight plastic bag food grade?

BTW, if the malt is stale you'll know it. Ever had a stale cracker or pretzel?

Since the grains are hard and it tastes OK, I don't think you can conclude that it's stale. And I cn imagine a matter using a bag that isn't food grade. Have you seen anything to conclude that could be the case?
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Offline Bel Air Brewing

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2022, 10:00:08 am »
Sounds to me the heavy weight plastic bag allowed oxygen inside thereby causing the stale malt. May want to consider getting some food grade buckets with decent lids for malt storage especially since it's unknown what chemicals were used to make the heavy weight plastic bag. Was the heavy weight plastic bag food grade?

BTW, if the malt is stale you'll know it. Ever had a stale cracker or pretzel?

Since the grains are hard and it tastes OK, I don't think you can conclude that it's stale. And I cn imagine a matter using a bag that isn't food grade. Have you seen anything to conclude that could be the case?

The thick plastic bag is the one that the local supplier used. Two pounds was purchased, and I had used some of the grain previously, and then sealed the bag again using a vacuum sealer, although all of the air was not removed.

As we buy grain in 55 lb bags, the grain is stored in the original bag until it is used up. Even with some grains that might approach 12 months old, never had any issues with storage.

To recap, this grain has a faint aroma of stale (rancid) peanuts. Or stale cooking oil. Very faint. But is still very crunchy, and tastes fine.
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Offline denny

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2022, 10:02:18 am »
Sounds to me the heavy weight plastic bag allowed oxygen inside thereby causing the stale malt. May want to consider getting some food grade buckets with decent lids for malt storage especially since it's unknown what chemicals were used to make the heavy weight plastic bag. Was the heavy weight plastic bag food grade?

BTW, if the malt is stale you'll know it. Ever had a stale cracker or pretzel?

Since the grains are hard and it tastes OK, I don't think you can conclude that it's stale. And I cn imagine a matter using a bag that isn't food grade. Have you seen anything to conclude that could be the case?

The thick plastic bag is the one that the local supplier used. I had used some of the grain previously, and then sealed the bag again using a vacuum sealer, although all of the air was not removed.

As we buy grain in 55 lb bags, the grain is stored in the original bag until it is used up. Even with some grains that might approach 12 months old, never had any issues with storage.

To recap, this grain has a faint aroma of stale (rancid) peanuts. Or stale cooking oil. Very faint. But is still very crunchy, and tastes fine.

How about doing a hot steep and tasting the extract? That should give you a pretty good idea of the flavor.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell

Offline tommymorris

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2022, 10:50:45 am »
Sounds to me the heavy weight plastic bag allowed oxygen inside thereby causing the stale malt. May want to consider getting some food grade buckets with decent lids for malt storage especially since it's unknown what chemicals were used to make the heavy weight plastic bag. Was the heavy weight plastic bag food grade?

BTW, if the malt is stale you'll know it. Ever had a stale cracker or pretzel?

Since the grains are hard and it tastes OK, I don't think you can conclude that it's stale. And I cn imagine a matter using a bag that isn't food grade. Have you seen anything to conclude that could be the case?

The thick plastic bag is the one that the local supplier used. I had used some of the grain previously, and then sealed the bag again using a vacuum sealer, although all of the air was not removed.

As we buy grain in 55 lb bags, the grain is stored in the original bag until it is used up. Even with some grains that might approach 12 months old, never had any issues with storage.

To recap, this grain has a faint aroma of stale (rancid) peanuts. Or stale cooking oil. Very faint. But is still very crunchy, and tastes fine.

How about doing a hot steep and tasting the extract? That should give you a pretty good idea of the flavor.
Didn’t the birds already eat it? :)

Offline Bel Air Brewing

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Re: Stale Grain?
« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2022, 11:24:33 am »
Sounds to me the heavy weight plastic bag allowed oxygen inside thereby causing the stale malt. May want to consider getting some food grade buckets with decent lids for malt storage especially since it's unknown what chemicals were used to make the heavy weight plastic bag. Was the heavy weight plastic bag food grade?

BTW, if the malt is stale you'll know it. Ever had a stale cracker or pretzel?

Since the grains are hard and it tastes OK, I don't think you can conclude that it's stale. And I cn imagine a matter using a bag that isn't food grade. Have you seen anything to conclude that could be the case?

The thick plastic bag is the one that the local supplier used. I had used some of the grain previously, and then sealed the bag again using a vacuum sealer, although all of the air was not removed.

As we buy grain in 55 lb bags, the grain is stored in the original bag until it is used up. Even with some grains that might approach 12 months old, never had any issues with storage.

To recap, this grain has a faint aroma of stale (rancid) peanuts. Or stale cooking oil. Very faint. But is still very crunchy, and tastes fine.

How about doing a hot steep and tasting the extract? That should give you a pretty good idea of the flavor.
Didn’t the birds already eat it? :)

Ha! No, my wife put a small amount in one of her bird feeders. They have not touched it. I have about one pound (+/-) left.
Winning Gold Medals isn't everything, but it sure is fun!