Author Topic: Oktoberfest 2011  (Read 19372 times)

Offline blatz

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #60 on: May 04, 2011, 03:48:06 PM »

That much?  That's a starter thats more than a gallon (3.7L = 1 Gallon).  That seems extreme (1/4 of the batch!?)

hence why we chill and decant spent wort before pitching.  ;)
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Offline Beer Monger

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #61 on: May 04, 2011, 03:51:47 PM »

That much?  That's a starter thats more than a gallon (3.7L = 1 Gallon).  That seems extreme (1/4 of the batch!?)

hence why we chill and decant spent wort before pitching.  ;)

With my 600 ml starters, I usually just add the whole starter to the batch.  Are you saying you decant off the wort from the starter & just pitch the yeast cake that's left behind w/ a starter this big? 

I'll need to buy a new jar.  I don't have a 2-gallon starter vessel - just 1-gallon ones. 
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Offline blatz

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #62 on: May 04, 2011, 03:54:40 PM »
Are you saying you decant off the wort from the starter & just pitch the yeast cake that's left behind w/ a starter this big? 

yep - although I do it with all starters - starter wort, esp when its been on a stir plate is not exactly tasty - I want as little of that in my finished product as possible.
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Offline Beer Monger

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #63 on: May 04, 2011, 03:58:19 PM »
Are you saying you decant off the wort from the starter & just pitch the yeast cake that's left behind w/ a starter this big? 

yep - although I do it with all starters - starter wort, esp when its been on a stir plate is not exactly tasty - I want as little of that in my finished product as possible.

Yeah, I suppose I shouldn't be pitching the whole 600ml starters either.  Laziness.  lol  I guess I need to change my ways.  ;)

Thanks for the info.   I guess I'd better get my starter going today (brewing on Saturday). 
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Offline blatz

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #64 on: May 04, 2011, 04:00:34 PM »
just to be sure - you did see the chill step, correct?  you'll need to cold crash the starter at least overnight before decanting, otherwise you'll be dumping a lot of good yeast.  I find 48 hours is optimal.
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Offline gordonstrong

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #65 on: May 04, 2011, 04:02:15 PM »
If you want some sweetness in the beer, I might swap out the C-60 for CaraMunich.  The flavors will be more appropriate. 
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Offline hopfenundmalz

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #66 on: May 04, 2011, 04:16:35 PM »

That much?  That's a starter thats more than a gallon (3.7L = 1 Gallon).  That seems extreme (1/4 of the batch!?)

hence why we chill and decant spent wort before pitching.  ;)
The Engineer in me has to point out that 1 gallon = 3.79 liters, so use 3.8l/gallon.  You often see recipes stated as 19 liters or 5 gallons, so the 3.8 works better for quick calculations.

If your yeast is healthy, the correct amount is pitched, and you give them plenty of O2 in the wort before they are pitched, you fermentation should be just about done in 5 to 6 days.   I used to say 2 weeks for a lager, but not anymore.  Keep an eye on the gravity and start the D-rest while you have a few degrees plato to go.
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Offline gmac

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #67 on: May 04, 2011, 04:17:25 PM »
Are the crystal/cara malts necessary?  Here's what I have been debating for mine (work in progress)

5 lb Vienna Malt
4 lb 2-row Pale Malt
0.5 oz Perle at 90
0.5 oz Hallertau at 30
0.5 oz Hallertau at 15
Irish Moss at 15
WLP833 - 3L starter - shaken and chilled prior to decanting

That's it.  I was going to try this as a small decoction to develop more of the malt flavours (30 min boil and then add to raise temp from 146 to 154).

This is partly because I don't have any crystal and partly because I've never brewed without it and am curious what the body will be like.  I'm assuming that an O'fest should be a bit darker than this will likely be and I'm considering a colour addition of 1 oz of chocolate malt at sparge (or Black Patent) to add colour only (no sinimar on hand).

I need new batteries for my pH meter or I'd have it done.  My water is pretty alkaline so with this much light malt, I want to be sure I can hit the right pH before I decoct anything.  Or am I worried about that for no reason as well?

Offline bluesman

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #68 on: May 04, 2011, 04:24:29 PM »
Are the crystal/cara malts necessary?  Here's what I have been debating for mine (work in progress)

I recommend a small addition of Caramunich to give the malt profile some complexity. I would suggest Cara 2. It has some of the richer notes that a Spaten or an Ayinger possess. It will also depend on the exact profile that you're trying to achieve. Do you have a commercial example in mind?
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Offline gordonstrong

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #69 on: May 04, 2011, 04:27:08 PM »
Not necessary but I like the taste so I usually add some.  I leave it out of Viennas.

I would swap the 2-row pale out and replace with pils malt.
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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #70 on: May 04, 2011, 04:27:50 PM »
If you want some sweetness in the beer, I might swap out the C-60 for CaraMunich.  The flavors will be more appropriate. 

Thanks, Gordon.  I'll try that swap.  :)


A few more questions for a lager newbie:

-I know the packet will tell me, but what is the proper fermentation temp for WY2206

-How long do I hold the fermenter at that temp?  And will I need to raise the temp at some point for a dicetyl rest?  

-Am I supposed to lower the temp from the fermentation temp for the longer 'lagering' phase?  

-I'm OK doing the lagering in kegs, right?  After racking off the yeast?  

-If I lager in kegs, will I need to later rack them to other kegs - or can I finish & serve from these kegs?  

Thanks!!!!!  :)  
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Offline Beer Monger

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #71 on: May 04, 2011, 04:28:27 PM »
Not necessary but I like the taste so I usually add some.  I leave it out of Viennas.

I would swap the 2-row pale out and replace with pils malt.

+1  Agreed. 
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Offline tygo

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #72 on: May 04, 2011, 04:28:48 PM »
I put a little crystal in mine last year (slightly less than 5%) and I thought it was too caramelly.  This year I'm leaving it out entirely to try that approach out.  All depends on your tastes.
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Offline gordonstrong

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #73 on: May 04, 2011, 04:33:09 PM »
I tend to ferment lagers at 48-50F (9-10C).  How long?  Until it's done.  D-rest?  Only if it needs it.  Taste it.  Lower temp?  Yes, ramp it down so you don't inadvertently crash the yeast.  You want the yeast to still be active.  Yes, you can lager in kegs.  Yes, you rack it before lagering. You can finish and serve in the lagering keg, but I prefer to fine with gelatin and rack into a serving keg for a better presentation.  But if you aren't moving the keg around, you might just leave it.  Just look for extra trub when you pour the first pint.  General keg advice.
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Offline gordonstrong

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Re: Oktoberfest 2011
« Reply #74 on: May 04, 2011, 04:35:20 PM »
I put a little crystal in mine last year (slightly less than 5%) and I thought it was too caramelly.  This year I'm leaving it out entirely to try that approach out.  All depends on your tastes.

Right; that's why I suggested ditching the C-60.  Caramel is the wrong flavor.  You can leave these malts out entirely, but if you use them, I think the CaraMunich flavors fit best.  CaraVienne would be a distant second choice.
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