Author Topic: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed  (Read 8661 times)

Offline homebrewgamecock

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #45 on: April 27, 2011, 02:37:41 PM »
That sucks the bill did not pass.  I can't imagine not being able to homebrew.  Just glad that CO is all about homebrewing and good beer. 

Let's hope someone soon AL legalizes it.  The whole exposing your children to booze argument is really lame.

ccarlson

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #46 on: April 27, 2011, 02:40:36 PM »
Obviously, I don't agree with the AL homebrew laws, but it's refreshing that states still have some rights left.

Offline beersk

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #47 on: April 27, 2011, 02:42:00 PM »
These legislators are a disgrace to the human race.  Someday, hopefully they'll realize it's 2011 and not 1931.
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Offline maxieboy

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #48 on: April 27, 2011, 03:23:59 PM »
Most These legislators are a disgrace to the human race.  Someday, hopefully they'll realize it's 2011 and not 1931.

Fixed.  ;)
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Offline majorvices

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #49 on: April 27, 2011, 04:33:50 PM »
Obviously, I don't agree with the AL homebrew laws, but it's refreshing that states still have some rights left.

I live and own a brewery in Alabama and let me just inform you that your statement is absurd.
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ccarlson

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #50 on: April 27, 2011, 04:44:50 PM »
Obviously, I don't agree with the AL homebrew laws, but it's refreshing that states still have some rights left.

I live and own a brewery in Alabama and let me just inform you that your statement is absurd.

Why's that? Seems to me that the law is probably protecting your interests, but again, I said I was against it. I'm just for states being able to decide what they think is best for their state. Don't like it, move or vote in new people.  
« Last Edit: April 27, 2011, 05:05:19 PM by ccarlson »

Offline majorvices

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #51 on: April 27, 2011, 05:10:16 PM »
This is how much you know about Alabama politics. Its usually not ever allowed to come up for a vote. That's the problem. And as a brewer - and business owner - we have a slew of other legislative issues that need to be addressed. But the powers that be are taking money from the beer distributors and big beer to keep our legislation from ever coming to a vote.

And to suggest that I "move to another state" is absurd. I have invested my life savings in this state. Its simply not that easy.

That said, I agree that if a county would vote to be dry they should have that right. But when it is kept from coming to a vote by selected interest - that's wrong. Plain wrong. And it is a far cry from freedom.
Keith Y.

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #52 on: April 27, 2011, 05:12:15 PM »
Seems to me that the law is probably protecting your interests,  

BTW if you think I would be for something that would protect my interests but take a freedom away from other people you have me pegged wrong. Besides, homebrewers are craft beer supporters. Everyone knows that.
Keith Y.

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Offline maxieboy

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #53 on: April 27, 2011, 05:15:50 PM »
Follow the money...
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ccarlson

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #54 on: April 27, 2011, 05:16:57 PM »
This is how much you know about Alabama politics. Its usually not ever allowed to come up for a vote. That's the problem. And as a brewer - and business owner - we have a slew of other legislative issues that need to be addressed. But the powers that be are taking money from the beer distributors and big beer to keep our legislation from ever coming to a vote.

And to suggest that I "move to another state" is absurd. I have invested my life savings in this state. Its simply not that easy.

That said, I agree that if a county would vote to be dry they should have that right. But when it is kept from coming to a vote by selected interest - that's wrong. Plain wrong. And it is a far cry from freedom.

Well, I know that this thread was all about it coming to a vote and not passing. I admit that I didn't know that before I read the thread, but now I do. Maybe you should start at the beginning of the thread, as I did. Again, my second suggestion, which probably applies more to you, is to vote in new legislators. It's not a perfect system, but it's all we/you got.

Offline tommeier

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #55 on: April 27, 2011, 09:59:43 PM »

You quote the right sections, the prohibition act (dry county laws)   What complicates things is when an area goes wet it follows the ABC act which says, do not follow the dry county laws..   Guess what that means?   If a county goes wet, then the illegal manufacture language you posted is no longer applicable.  Yeah us, we can brew!   Wait, not so fast, says ABC!   We have case law that says homebrewing was deemed illegal even in a wet county.

Info from Mike Bishop, Alabama ABC Agent, circa 2005:
"      (Lovett v. State, 1943), says that "the sections of the prohibition law not repealed by the ABC Act, and which have a field of operation in wet counties consistent with the Act, are still effective." In talking with the ABC Board's attorney, it seems that although there is not a specific law that prohibits homebrew, there is no law that authorizes it, either.   "

Bottom line, they feel the illegal manuf portion of the dry county section are still applicable, since then ABC act doesn't say anything new.  So it still has a 'field of operation'.  A homebrewer lawyer john Little agrees with this interpretation.   As such they feel they can confiscate equipment, they threaten to shut down HB shops, (possession of equipment) who sell complete start up brewing kits as a set.   They allow sale of separate equipment but packaged together is where they draw the line since the use becomes clear when its used together.  They basically feel they can interpret the law this way, even tho we know of no one in modern times who has been convicted strictly for brewing.  Agent Bishop recalls fining someone 250 and taking his equipment in the early 90s..    I suspect there are quite a few people in dry counties who are not hobbyists that have been convicted.

Our bill would not apply to dry counties..  It would be a miracle to get a bill through for dry counties...it'd be easier to get the county to vote wet than do that.,  An enforcement issue in their eyes.   The legislator will not do anything without ABCs blessing so essentially the enforcement arm is also the legislative arm, when it comes to writing the bill.

Probably the most valid argument a defendant could have is that personal use not for sale does not constitute "manufacture"...  And therefore would not be illegal. 
Posted from Alabama: Where homebrewing is considered illegal only because there is no law specifically making it legal (Lovett v. State, 1943).  A backwards state, literally and figuratively.

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #56 on: April 27, 2011, 10:13:35 PM »
Info from Mike Bishop, Alabama ABC Agent, circa 2005:
"      (Lovett v. State, 1943), says that "the sections of the prohibition law not repealed by the ABC Act, and which have a field of operation in wet counties consistent with the Act, are still effective." In talking with the ABC Board's attorney, it seems that although there is not a specific law that prohibits homebrew, there is no law that authorizes it, either.   "

Bottom line, they feel the illegal manuf portion of the dry county section are still applicable, since then ABC act doesn't say anything new.  So it still has a 'field of operation'.
Wait, so there is a law that prohibits it, and it is found in the dry county section of the laws?  And it still applies, because only some of the dry county laws were repealed for wet counties?  Am I understanding that right?

Are you going to be in SD?  Bringing your wife this time?  We'll have to get together for beers with the czechs, as usual. ;D
Tom Schmidlin

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #57 on: April 28, 2011, 04:51:57 AM »

Probably the most valid argument a defendant could have is that personal use not for sale does not constitute "manufacture"...  And therefore would not be illegal. 

Interesting perspective.

What's the legal definition of "manufacture" ?

If I pickle cucumbers from my vegetable garden for personal consumption. Does that constitute "manufacture" ?
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Offline homebrewgamecock

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #58 on: April 28, 2011, 09:03:42 AM »
So, are there actually homebrew shops in AL?  Do they really crack down on homebrewers?  Are there many people that brew in AL because of this law?  Just curious.

Very strange to me that it's a felony to homebrew.

Well,  I hope all our AL residents are OK with the recent tornadoes and storms.  Prayers out to y'all and I hope you are safe.

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Re: Alabama Homebrew Legalization 2011 = Failed
« Reply #59 on: April 28, 2011, 09:39:44 AM »
In all counties of the state it shall be unlawful for any person, firm or corporation to have in his or its possession any still or apparatus to be used for the manufacture of any alcoholic beverage of any kind

So... wouldn't this mean they can go after the homebrew shops in AL?  Not for grains or yeast or other ingredients, but for selling the necessary 'apparatus' to homebrew? 

It's telling that they don't (go after the AL homebrew shops - and yes a few do exist). 
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