[jeffy]

I saw this today:
Born OK the First Time

[phillamb168]

Back to the topic: I have only one bumper sticker - "I brew the beer I drink" - apparently I'm the only AHA member who put that on his car,

I'm skeptical about putting any beer-related bumper stickers on my car. It just seems like you're asking for trouble from the cops. Not quite as bad as "Legalize hemp", "Bad cop, no doughnut," or "F*** the Pigs!", but still.

If they made them, I'd want "I'm Your Worst Nightmare, and I Vote."

A benefit to living in France, of course - the grammatical structure of the bumper sticker is a bit complex for someone who doesn't really speak English.

[phillamb168]

Hybrids are for losers. Me, I already put down my deposit on my electric car: http://www.teslamotors.com/models

Very cool car, but how do you power that baby?  At that price I'm thinking maybe the electrcity fairy comes down, waves his wand and -POOF!- charged batteries?  

The French get like 80% of their electricity from nukes.  Would that make it a nuclear powered car?  

I know, you can call it the Nautilus!  

If it comes with a flux capacitor I'm all in!

Ha! Nice idea. But no, the plan is to install a couple solar panels with a deep cycle battery and use that to charge however much I can, then use house 220v for whatever's left. Electricity is super cheap here - I have two beer fridges, a regular fridge, a freezer, washing machine, dishwasher, tv, all those new-fangled eee-lectronics, and my monthly elec bill is usually below 100. The car would bump that, most likely, to 120 or 130 - but that's driving it every day. It'll have paid itself off in gas savings after a while.

[ccarlson]

Hybrids are for losers. Me, I already put down my deposit on my electric car: http://www.teslamotors.com/models

Very cool car, but how do you power that baby?  At that price I'm thinking maybe the electrcity fairy comes down, waves his wand and -POOF!- charged batteries?  

The French get like 80% of their electricity from nukes.  Would that make it a nuclear powered car?  

I know, you can call it the Nautilus!  

If it comes with a flux capacitor I'm all in!

Ha! Nice idea. But no, the plan is to install a couple solar panels with a deep cycle battery and use that to charge however much I can, then use house 220v for whatever's left. Electricity is super cheap here - I have two beer fridges, a regular fridge, a freezer, washing machine, dishwasher, tv, all those new-fangled eee-lectronics, and my monthly elec bill is usually below 100. The car would bump that, most likely, to 120 or 130 - but that's driving it every day. It'll have paid itself off in gas savings after a while.

I don't think you've run out the numbers. Lets say your electricity is free and you pay $8 a gallon for gas. I believe the car you're looking at was about $49K. If you drove 100,000 miles with a 30 MPG car you would have spent $26,667.00 for gas. You're barely over half way to paying it off. Now keep in mind that somewhere around 100K miles, you'll need a new set of batteries and by today's estimates that between $8000 and $12,000. Battery technology will likely improve and those costs will come down. However, battery replacement will always be a very large expense.

I'm ready for an all electric car with a decent range, but they're just not there yet. Hopefully, someday soon.

[punatic]

And the cost of charging electricity is added to that calculation.

[phillamb168]

Hybrids are for losers. Me, I already put down my deposit on my electric car: http://www.teslamotors.com/models

Very cool car, but how do you power that baby?  At that price I'm thinking maybe the electrcity fairy comes down, waves his wand and -POOF!- charged batteries?  

The French get like 80% of their electricity from nukes.  Would that make it a nuclear powered car?  

I know, you can call it the Nautilus!  

If it comes with a flux capacitor I'm all in!

Ha! Nice idea. But no, the plan is to install a couple solar panels with a deep cycle battery and use that to charge however much I can, then use house 220v for whatever's left. Electricity is super cheap here - I have two beer fridges, a regular fridge, a freezer, washing machine, dishwasher, tv, all those new-fangled eee-lectronics, and my monthly elec bill is usually below 100. The car would bump that, most likely, to 120 or 130 - but that's driving it every day. It'll have paid itself off in gas savings after a while.

I don't think you've run out the numbers. Lets say your electricity is free and you pay $8 a gallon for gas. I believe the car you're looking at was about $49K. If you drove 100,000 miles with a 30 MPG car you would have spent $26,667.00 for gas. You're barely over half way to paying it off. Now keep in mind that somewhere around 100K miles, you'll need a new set of batteries and by today's estimates that between $8000 and $12,000. Battery technology will likely improve and those costs will come down. However, battery replacement will always be a very large expense.

I'm ready for an all electric car with a decent range, but they're just not there yet. Hopefully, someday soon.

This assumes a fixed price on gasoline over the cost of the car. When I first started driving a little over 10 years ago, gas was $0.75 a gallon. You can do the math on that one.

Also, the Model S I'm going for has a range of 300 miles per charge, although we'll call that 200 miles just to be safe. We have this thing here in Europe called a 'train network' and pretty much any traveling I want to do that's more than 100 miles away, I can take a train. Also of note, 220v is the standard so if for some reason I am stuck out with a dead battery, I can rent a hotel room and get an extension cord.

Another really nice thing the train companies have started doing here, I don't remember what it's called, but the regional and long-distance trains have cargo cars and you get to take your car with you wherever you're going.

You're absolutely right that the Model S and its ilk make no sense, but that's only if you live in the US and do a lot of driving. Were I in the US, I wouldn't buy it.

[ccarlson]

I'm not questioning your driving habits or what mass transit you have at your disposal, I'm simply replying to your comment "It'll have paid itself off in gas savings after a while." I don't think you could drive enough to pay it off with gas savings. I have run out the numbers on several models and it's just not cost effective, as much as I would like it to be.

[nicneufeld]

I'm just waiting for nuclear pulse propulsion.

Anyway, electric cars at this point are what I would call an aggressive short sell on gas prices.  By todays numbers, they won't pay for themselves for the higher price in savings, but theoretically if gas price shoots up enough, at some point you would start saving money.  Of course, if gas does start costing 15 dollars a gallon, then by the same token you can imagine how quickly all the various oil-producing nations, including us, would be scrabbling to get it out of the ground, and then oversupply is going to temper that cost pretty quickly.  Anyway, I see no problem getting an electric car but I'd get it because you want it, or think its cool, rather than from any belief that it is a sure thing for financial benefit, because at this point it seems unlikely to save you much, if any money.  But its time may come!

I'm fairly fortunate in that my family only drives maybe 1000-2000 miles a year.  Gas just isn't as significant an expense as it is for other folks.

[mainebrewer]

Referring back to some earlier posts:
"Visualize using your turn signals"
and
"Just because you're different doesn't mean you're useful"
are a couple of my favorites.

[gordonstrong]

"Just because you're different doesn't mean you're useful"

[tschmidlin]

I don't think you've run out the numbers. Lets say your electricity is free and you pay $8 a gallon for gas. I believe the car you're looking at was about $49K. If you drove 100,000 miles with a 30 MPG car you would have spent $26,667.00 for gas. You're barely over half way to paying it off. Now keep in mind that somewhere around 100K miles, you'll need a new set of batteries and by today's estimates that between $8000 and $12,000. Battery technology will likely improve and those costs will come down. However, battery replacement will always be a very large expense.

I'm ready for an all electric car with a decent range, but they're just not there yet. Hopefully, someday soon.

I'm not disputing your point, but you need to subtract out the cost of a similar car that is gasoline powered in order to determine what the break even amount is.  It's not the full $49k.

Bumper sticker - "Make Beer, Not War"

[ccarlson]

I don't think you've run out the numbers. Lets say your electricity is free and you pay $8 a gallon for gas. I believe the car you're looking at was about $49K. If you drove 100,000 miles with a 30 MPG car you would have spent $26,667.00 for gas. You're barely over half way to paying it off. Now keep in mind that somewhere around 100K miles, you'll need a new set of batteries and by today's estimates that between $8000 and $12,000. Battery technology will likely improve and those costs will come down. However, battery replacement will always be a very large expense.

I'm ready for an all electric car with a decent range, but they're just not there yet. Hopefully, someday soon.

I'm not disputing your point, but you need to subtract out the cost of a similar car that is gasoline powered in order to determine what the break even amount is.  It's not the full $49k.

Bumper sticker - "Make Beer, Not War"

I assumed that he already had a gas car and again, I'm only trying to comment on this statement: "It'll have paid itself off in gas savings after a while." Even if you bought a gas car and an electric car for the same price( which is highly unlikely), you're not really saving any money with electricity when you include battery replacement and that is a real cost.

[corkybstewart]

I don't think you've run out the numbers. Lets say your electricity is free and you pay $8 a gallon for gas. I believe the car you're looking at was about $49K. If you drove 100,000 miles with a 30 MPG car you would have spent $26,667.00 for gas. You're barely over half way to paying it off. Now keep in mind that somewhere around 100K miles, you'll need a new set of batteries and by today's estimates that between $8000 and $12,000. Battery technology will likely improve and those costs will come down. However, battery replacement will always be a very large expense.

I'm ready for an all electric car with a decent range, but they're just not there yet. Hopefully, someday soon.

I'm not disputing your point, but you need to subtract out the cost of a similar car that is gasoline powered in order to determine what the break even amount is.  It's not the full $49k.

Bumper sticker - "Make Beer, Not War"

I assumed that he already had a gas car and again, I'm only trying to comment on this statement: "It'll have paid itself off in gas savings after a while." Even if you bought a gas car and an electric car for the same price( which is highly unlikely), you're not really saving any money with electricity when you include battery replacement and that is a real cost.

It gets even more complicated when you try to figure the real cost of gasoline.  How much lost productivity is there from respiratory illness due to pollution caused by gasoline cars?  How much do we pay for increased military costs to either A prop up terrorists states that hates us or B: invade terrorist states that hate us?  This kind of discussion can get really complicated if you want it to, or you can just figure how much an individual pays out of pocket for transportation.  Hint:  Sell the electric car before you think the battery will die and let the new owner adsorb that cost.

[bonjour]

Can we bring this back to bumper stickers please

[punatic]

I'm just waiting for nuclear pulse propulsion.

That will certainly take care of any talegaters!  

Future bumper sticker:

"Have You Checked Your Dosimeter Lately?"

Hint:  Sell the electric car before you think the battery will die and let the new owner adsorb that cost.

Well THAT is really being green, isn't it.

Future bumper sticker:

"I'm Really Pissed at the Deadbeat That Stuck Me With His Dead Battery Toxic Waste!"