[James Lorden]

Looks like some experimenting is in my future. Bummer

[blatz]

James

Its really dependent on what you are after.  If you're just worried about fermentation, but don't plan on reusing the yeast, then I probably wouldn't even worry about dumping at all, at any point. 

I feel that Martin's comments are more esoteric to his setup (small batch in a bigger conical) and I entirely understand his logic - though in his case, if I was looking to reuse the yeast, I would brew 5.5-6.5gal batches so that I could dump CB/Dead yeast and harvest a better colony but not worry about not being able to filla  keg. 

I think if you're looking at re-pitching, what I suggested will work well for your system.  If you're not, then it probably doesn't really matter to dump at all.

I usually dump the trub after 24 hrs. My concern with dumping the trub is dropping out the highly flocculating yeast that settle first. That's why I try to remember to drop the trub as early as possible, preferably before high krausen.

I'm rather surprised at that- one in that its not that difficult to see the change from trub to yeast, and two from what I've read and heard from others (pros, experienced posters, etc) , you don't want the most highly floculating yeast - i.e. ones that settle before high krausen anyways - you want from the middle - if you were to consistently select the most flocculant, wouldn't you eventually have attenuation problems?  Maybe you have other reasons for doing this, but I'm lost on the logic here.

[bluesman]

James

Its really dependent on what you are after.  If you're just worried about fermentation, but don't plan on reusing the yeast, then I probably wouldn't even worry about dumping at all, at any point.  

I feel that Martin's comments are more esoteric to his setup (small batch in a bigger conical) and I entirely understand his logic - though in his case, if I was looking to reuse the yeast, I would brew 5.5-6.5gal batches so that I could dump CB/Dead yeast and harvest a better colony but not worry about not being able to filla  keg.  

I think if you're looking at re-pitching, what I suggested will work well for your system.  If you're not, then it probably doesn't really matter to dump at all.

I usually dump the trub after 24 hrs. My concern with dumping the trub is dropping out the highly flocculating yeast that settle first. That's why I try to remember to drop the trub as early as possible, preferably before high krausen.

I'm rather surprised at that- one in that its not that difficult to see the change from trub to yeast, and two from what I've read and heard from others (pros, experienced posters, etc) , you don't want the most highly floculating yeast - i.e. ones that settle before high krausen anyways - you want from the middle - if you were to consistently select the most flocculant, wouldn't you eventually have attenuation problems?  Maybe you have other reasons for doing this, but I'm lost on the logic here.

The intent of dropping the trub prior to yeast flocculation is that you don't want to drop out the most flocculative yeast (bottom) with the trub. When harvesting yeast you want a representative sample of the yeast...not just the middle or top but you want the most flocculative, the somewhat flocculative and the yeast that remains in insuspension longest, to aid in cleanup of fermentation by-products at late krausen. By harvesting the entire yeast cake and rinsing, one will achieve a clean representative selection of the yeast produced during ferment.

[blatz]

The intent of dropping the trub prior to yeast flocculation is that you don't want to drop out the most flocculative yeast (bottom) with the trub. When harvesting yeast you want a representative sample of the yeast...not just the middle or top but you want the most flocculative, the somewhat flocculative and the yeast that remains in insuspension longest, to aid in cleanup of fermentation by-products at late krausen. By harvesting the entire yeast cake and rinsing, one will achieve a clean representative selection of the yeast produced during ferment.

First I've seen of that, but maybe its from Chris White's book which I lent to a friend before I've had a chance to read it and I still don't have it back  

FWIW, as I keep saying, I don't discard but maybe <5% of yeast - its very easy to see the change.

I like my method and its very successful for me and the guys I got the idea from;  to each his own.