Author Topic: Help with Dubbel Trouble  (Read 1515 times)

Offline rdwhahb

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Help with Dubbel Trouble
« on: July 20, 2011, 11:12:29 PM »
I mash in a 9 gallon coleman extreme and was wondering what would be the best approach to the mash with my set up? I was thinking of mashing at @ 145 for 60 minutes as I am not sure how I would raise the temp up over the complete mash time.

To get to a 154 temp I heat my mash water to 190 let it sit in the cooler for 5 - 10 minutes then add the grains and stir for a couple of minutes and it works out well to get the 154 temp.

Here is the recipe

http://www.homebrewersassociation.org/pages/community/blog/show?title=recipe-of-the-week-dubbel-trouble

Offline nateo

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Re: Help with Dubbel Trouble
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2011, 02:22:52 AM »
IMO the step mash seems silly with this recipe. If you're truly using malts that need to be step mashed, that'd be a different story. But even continental pils malt should be able to do a single infusion. You'd probably get the same results from a single rest @ 154*
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Offline euge

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Re: Help with Dubbel Trouble
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2011, 06:01:10 AM »
Step-mashing reportedly is unnecessary since modern malt is so well modified. If so, why is it still done? I've never been able to get a Dubbel dry enough even when mashing @146F for 90 minutes. Perhaps it was a pH issue, but then again maybe the step mash would've helped.

Recipe looks decent. I'd given up on brewing the Belgie's but- *sigh* could always try another.
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Offline andyi

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Re: Help with Dubbel Trouble
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2011, 11:34:09 AM »
Step-mashing reportedly is unnecessary since modern malt is so well modified. If so, why is it still done? I've never been able to get a Dubbel dry enough even when mashing @146F for 90 minutes. Perhaps it was a pH issue, but then again maybe the step mash would've helped.

Recipe looks decent. I'd given up on brewing the Belgie's but- *sigh* could always try another.

My mash profile for Dubbel's is  single step 90min @ 150F, I use RO water with salts added in mash for to get at least 50ppm of Ca and adjust pH.  Even with a highly fermentable wort the fermentation profile is where I get the attenuation.

I use mr malty calculator and add additional 20% wort vol (personal pref.)  Stir plate for 72hrs (stll playing with total time),  chill overnight, decant, and pitch.  I have temp control and for WLP530 I pitch at 64F hold for day and then let rise and finish and hold at ~72F letting sit on yeast for at least a week after FG.  I get the "dryness" I'm looking for maybe 8 out of nine beers and its always tricky with dark versions.

For me, getting within a pH range 5.3-5.7, 90m boil for pils, and fermentation control have improved my belgians quality.  I only brew belgians and they still drive me crazy.  Hang in.

Offline rdwhahb

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Re: Help with Dubbel Trouble
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2011, 08:37:40 PM »
Thanks every one for the help. I don't plan on brewing this for another month or so but will post results when I do..

Offline nateo

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Re: Help with Dubbel Trouble
« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2011, 06:49:06 PM »
That's 145 not 154, but otherwise he's right you'll be ok with the single rest.  The step mash would be good too though

I actually recommended 154* because anything under 149* (like 145*) won't gelatinize the starch. If he then does a mashout he'll liberate unconverted starches which may cause issues with his beer.

The original recipe called for steps @ 140* and 160*. Splitting the difference would mean 150*. With the amount of candi syrup in the recipe, I'd mash a little higher than you might for an attenuative all-malt brew.  
« Last Edit: July 22, 2011, 06:51:01 PM by nateo »
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jaybeerman

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Re: Help with Dubbel Trouble
« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2011, 06:59:01 PM »
I actually recommended 154* because anything under 149* (like 145*) won't gelatinize the starch. If he then does a mashout he'll liberate unconverted starches which may cause issues with his beer.

The original recipe called for steps @ 140* and 160*. Splitting the difference would mean 150*. With the amount of candi syrup in the recipe, I'd mash a little higher than you might for an attenuative all-malt brew.  

Ok, I removed my reply.  I'm not sure I agree considering that it has 12 oz of Special B and 8 oz of wheat with only 12 oz of syrup, but I'm open to all interpretations and opinions.  Cheers, j

Offline tomsawyer

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Re: Help with Dubbel Trouble
« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2011, 07:53:02 PM »
I've found a step mash will let me mash for attenuation, then finish with a short alpha rest that boosts body and improves my efficiency.  I don't think you can duplicate this with a single infusion at a compromise temp.
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Offline dhacker

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Re: Help with Dubbel Trouble
« Reply #8 on: July 24, 2011, 07:26:52 PM »
I'd given up on brewing the Belgie's but- *sigh* could always try another.

PLEASE . . Do NOT give up on Belgian biers!!   ;)
Just brew it...

Offline nateo

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Re: Help with Dubbel Trouble
« Reply #9 on: July 24, 2011, 08:43:07 PM »
I've found a step mash will let me mash for attenuation, then finish with a short alpha rest that boosts body and improves my efficiency.  I don't think you can duplicate this with a single infusion at a compromise temp.

I've brewed a lot of Belgians, some with step mashes and some with single infusions. I can't really tell a difference either way. I think pitching rate is the most important factor by far in getting the attenuation you want. But, I've never brewed the exact same recipe back to back with different process.

I'll also use about 5% wheat malt in most recipes. This does seem to help my head retention and body, but again I haven't tried any back-to-back trials to compare, so take what I say with a sack of salt.
In der Kürze liegt die Würze.