Author Topic: You should all be fired  (Read 3270 times)

ccarlson

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #30 on: August 10, 2011, 08:13:18 AM »
On Friday night when I heard S&P was downgrading our debt the first thought I had was "How long will it be before a scandal over all the S&P Execs being primed to short the market, prior to the downgrade, comes out?".

That's really the only reason I can see for them doing it.  Everyone knew if the US lost it's AAA rating the only fast money to be made would be in short trades.  If you knew exactly when the downgrade was coming you could make out like the criminals these guys probably are.

Whatever the correct rating is, the folks at the S&P were manipulating the market.  We just need to wait and see who they were doing it for.

Paul

If that was their intent, they wouldn't have done it on a Friday after the market closed. Everyone had the entire weekend to plan the same.

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #31 on: August 10, 2011, 08:20:02 AM »
I hear you Euge - it's hard to talk about this in a way that avoids politics - although perhaps that means it just shouldn't be discussed on this forum... The problem is that I don't really have any other Americans to talk to about this with, other than you guys. Believe it or not, this forum is pretty much my only contact with the US outside of talking to my dad or brother occasionally, so forgive me if I sometimes toe the line a bit.

While I made some earlier comments, I wouldn't suggest getting too wrapped up in this thread. It'll be locked on its own or someone will say something to deliberately get it locked. I would also like to discuss topics like this, but it's true, some people can't do so without getting angry.

Well said....keep it to economics and there won't be a lock.
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Offline bluefoxicy

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #32 on: August 10, 2011, 09:40:39 AM »

While I made some earlier comments, I wouldn't suggest getting too wrapped up in this thread. It'll be locked on its own or someone will say something to deliberately get it locked. I would also like to discuss topics like this, but it's true, some people can't do so without getting angry.

There's an actual P&R forum on the bike forums ... the moderators in general don't bother with the incivility.  They have other issues (obvious spam, naked pictures, pasting of whole copyrighted articles...) but they don't care if you want to hurl insults and vague nonsense.

There's also a heavily locked down trollpost forum that gets just about no attention.

Offline gordonstrong

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #33 on: August 10, 2011, 09:43:35 AM »
That's the problem with economics.  The way economists interpret things seems to have more to do with their political beliefs than anything else.  If you have taken any amount of math and then take economics, you'll be infuriated at all the hand-waving they do.  They have equations but never solve them.

If you want to listen to an economist, the first thing you should do is understand their political bias.  Then you'll be able to understand them in context.

I guess I'm saying that you run into problems with forum politics rules when you venture into economics because they will invariably overlap.

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Offline bluesman

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #34 on: August 10, 2011, 09:52:26 AM »

I guess I'm saying that you run into problems with forum politics rules when you venture into economics because they will invariably overlap.


So true.

There's a fine line that can be walked when discussing spending and politics. We here on the forum have to be very careful where we tread sometimes.
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Offline tschmidlin

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #35 on: August 10, 2011, 12:05:40 PM »
The best bacon bit I've heard in a long time:

Glenn Beck on the wisdom of burying OBL at sea:

"If I could have had it my way, I'd have wrapped him in bacon, put him inside a football, and buried him underneath the 50 yard line in the Meadowlands."

Ah yes, I've heard of that recipe. The Jimmy Hoffa, they call it. Also Glenn Back is a putz. "The world is ending! Buy lots of golds!"

But hey, it looks good on you, yah?   ;)

My changing my stance on gold does not un-putz glen beck ;-)
The putziness of Glenn Beck and his "buy gold" stance was not so much that gold was ever a bad investment.  It was that the advertisers for his show sell gold coins that aren't worth what they sell them for, and customers end up (if they are lucky) barely able to recoup their investments.  Beck's fans trust him, and he's not doing them any favors, especially when he gets into nonsensical, fear mongering rants about the government coming to take your gold bullion.

One could argue that's not Beck's fault.  One could also argue "buyer beware".  Those are nice arguments to make as long as no one you know gets screwed by these guys.
Tom Schmidlin

Offline weithman5

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #36 on: August 10, 2011, 12:17:28 PM »
force equals the time rate of change of momentum. oh wait, we're not talking physics?  not that i would expect the people in office to have any understanding of physics, in fact when it comes to science they tend to be clueless. in fact i think most of them would not be employable outside of government checks
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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #37 on: August 10, 2011, 12:31:20 PM »
"Gold is always a good investment."  says the gold bugs.  Look at the historic price of gold, and you will see some big ups and big long term downs in the price.  Right now it is a good investment, when the music stops, don't be without a chair.  ;)
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Offline punatic

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #38 on: August 10, 2011, 01:33:21 PM »
force equals the time rate of change of momentum. oh wait, we're not talking physics?  not that i would expect the people in office to have any understanding of physics, in fact when it comes to science they tend to be clueless. in fact i think most of them would not be employable outside of government checks

F = ma

jeeze - I learned Newton's second law in elemetary school.

But the guys who went on to be politicians were really good at recess, as I recall.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2011, 01:35:06 PM by punatic »
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Offline punatic

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #39 on: August 10, 2011, 01:40:21 PM »
The best bacon bit I've heard in a long time:

Glenn Beck on the wisdom of burying OBL at sea:

"If I could have had it my way, I'd have wrapped him in bacon, put him inside a football, and buried him underneath the 50 yard line in the Meadowlands."

Ah yes, I've heard of that recipe. The Jimmy Hoffa, they call it. Also Glenn Back is a putz. "The world is ending! Buy lots of golds!"

But hey, it looks good on you, yah?   ;)

My changing my stance on gold does not un-putz glen beck ;-)
The putziness of Glenn Beck and his "buy gold" stance was not so much that gold was ever a bad investment.  It was that the advertisers for his show sell gold coins that aren't worth what they sell them for, and customers end up (if they are lucky) barely able to recoup their investments.  Beck's fans trust him, and he's not doing them any favors, especially when he gets into nonsensical, fear mongering rants about the government coming to take your gold bullion.

One could argue that's not Beck's fault.  One could also argue "buyer beware".  Those are nice arguments to make as long as no one you know gets screwed by these guys.

So Tom, you believe what Anthony Weiner was saying. 
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Offline tschmidlin

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #40 on: August 10, 2011, 02:15:20 PM »
So Tom, you believe what Anthony Weiner was saying. 
I wasn't aware of anything Weiner said and had to look it up.  I'm not sure I got the right quote, but this seems accurate to me: "many of them take the rhetorical excesses of a Glenn Beck and his like when they talk up gold and then immediately go to the advertisements to get ripped off".

Am I wrong?
Tom Schmidlin

Offline weithman5

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #41 on: August 10, 2011, 03:17:26 PM »
[

F = ma

jeeze - I learned Newton's second law in elemetary school.

But the guys who went on to be politicians were really good at recess, as I recall.

yes, mv equals momentum the rate of change with time and constant mass makes ma. (change in velocity with time is acceleration)

yes they were good at recess, but they were too afraid to show up at the bike rack at 3 pm when there were no teachers around ;D
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Offline loopy

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #42 on: August 10, 2011, 04:46:22 PM »
I learned my lesson about talking finance on a brewing board so I wont do it.  Don't worry, my days of ranting are well over, we have the government we deserve and that's that. 

That being said, CME just raised margins again on gold, this time up 22%
http://www.cnbc.com/id/44097598

This will reduce the mount of leverage people can use to buy gold, which will cause sells.  As price falls from supply/demand, it will force other margin calls.  It has happened a few times this year already, and you can see the violent whipsaws in the chart. 

Anytime you see parabolic blow off, you need to either find the exit or expect the eventual reversal.  yadda yadda short term trading versus long term trend, I get it, but in the short term, gold looks overbought to me.  good luck to you. 

Offline tubercle

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #43 on: August 10, 2011, 05:15:53 PM »
Probably one of the worst times in history to buy gold.

 I'll leave out the gory details, but at your leasure hours check out the average ROI vs the last 3 years. Nothing that good last. There will be blood letting and nashing of teeth.

 The value of gold (or anything else) is determined by the availability of a buyer at that price who is both willing and able to make the transfer for something of equal or greater value.  For example, just about everyone who wants (willing) and has the money to buy (able) gold already has. Its priced out of reach of the average person. Now the owners have no one to sell it to except each other.

See also: Housing bubble
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Offline 1vertical

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Re: You should all be fired
« Reply #44 on: August 10, 2011, 05:38:31 PM »
Probably one of the worst times in history to buy gold.

 I'll leave out the gory details, but at your leasure hours check out the average ROI vs the last 3 years. Nothing that good last. There will be blood letting and nashing of teeth.

 The value of gold (or anything else) is determined by the availability of a buyer at that price who is both willing and able to make the transfer for something of equal or greater value.  For example, just about everyone who wants (willing) and has the money to buy (able) gold already has. Its priced out of reach of the average person. Now the owners have no one to sell it to except each other.

See also: Housing bubble
That is all well and good Tubercle, but when the pile of paper money is larger than the loaf of bread it buys,
I will be willing to trade my hog or cow or eggs or ahem * beer for a slivver or two of gold....
when that paper ain't carrying much value unless you are burning it for comfort on a -40*f winter night....What good is that, quote" money to buy (able)" for anything?
A fine is a tax for doing wrong. A tax is a fine for doing well.