Author Topic: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral  (Read 10681 times)

Offline morticaixavier

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #165 on: January 05, 2012, 08:52:30 AM »
I'll add to this: As a homebrewer you have so much more control over your beer. You can pull it if it starts to develop flaws. As a pro I have dumped beer without hesitation, hurts as much or more than at home. But it is really difficult when you go to a pub or restaurant and your beer is not serving properly due to under-carbonation or signs of other flaws. I can honestly say we have done a pretty good job of quality control - unlike other local breweries we have gone well over a year without a returned keg. That is a real accomplishment IMO and one that I am proud of. Unfortunately there have been a few beers out there that developed stability problems that I am not too proud of. It's a tough gig to sit down with a pint of your own beer to discover that it is not what you had hoped it would be. Sacks the ego pretty hard. When it is homebrew you can just pull the tap. But once the beer leaves your brewery it is not yours anymore.

This is really insightful! I can imagine what that feels like. gotsta suck
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Offline majorvices

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #166 on: January 05, 2012, 09:20:13 AM »
Big highs and big lows. Recently I had a guy come up to me and tell me he liked all our specialty/seasonal beers. He didn't care at all for our flagship beers, but really loved our specialty beers.  ::)

Offline a10t2

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #167 on: January 05, 2012, 09:53:27 AM »
Big highs and big lows. Recently I had a guy come up to me and tell me he liked all our specialty/seasonal beers. He didn't care at all for our flagship beers, but really loved our specialty beers.  ::)

I get that all the time. Some people just like novelty, plain and simple.
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Offline Thirsty_Monk

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #168 on: January 05, 2012, 05:35:48 PM »
Big highs and big lows. Recently I had a guy come up to me and tell me he liked all our specialty/seasonal beers. He didn't care at all for our flagship beers, but really loved our specialty beers.  ::)

I get that all the time. Some people just like novelty, plain and simple.
I do agree. Novelty.
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Offline phillamb168

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #169 on: January 06, 2012, 04:34:28 AM »
Are we allowed to discuss equipment cost ranges? If so, I'm interested in what you mean by "a 3 bbl brewery costs nearly the same as a 10-20 bbl." Because for me, I can get started with 1.5BBL, everything paid in cash in advance and ready to go, for ~6.5k eur. Moving up to a 10-20 BBL requires a ton more space, plus much (much) more expensive equipment. The dairy industry here isn't nearly as big as it is in the US, and the price on used SS stuff is, frm my research, about 5 times more expensive than in the states. Sounds like my situation is way, way different than what most of you guys are facing, though... Is between 5.5 and 7k a reasonable cost, or am I paying too much? These are 55gal blichmanns with custom electricals, plus a couple or three blichmann ferminators, 47gal. Were I to buy fermenters here, minimum cost is two to three times what I'd pay for the blichmanns, and they have nothing near the build quality.
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Offline majorvices

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #170 on: January 06, 2012, 06:24:50 AM »
Well, we had built our facility to house a 15bbl brew house with 30 bbl tanks so I guess if you build a tiny space and don't expect to grow then it can be done for a lot cheaper. In terms of actual equipment we spent a good deal more on our jacketed conicals than we did on our little 40 gallon blichmanns. But 3bbl tanks are not much less than 7 bbl tanks which are not much less than 10 bbl tanks which are not much less than 15 bbl tanks.

Also, we probably spent 2Xs as much as Thirsty Monk on our initial build and he was putting out more beer in a month that we were our first quarter I highly encourage you to look at what he has done. I have stolen lots of ideas from him.). There are some really cheap methods of doing things if you look to frankenbuilding your equipment. And plastic conicals are extremely affordable and easy to rig. We bought 4 plastic 3 bbl conicals for as much as we paid for two 42 gallon blichmann conicals.

Offline phillamb168

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #171 on: January 06, 2012, 06:30:00 AM »
Well, we had built our facility to house a 15bbl brew house with 30 bbl tanks so I guess if you build a tiny space and don't expect to grow then it can be done for a lot cheaper. In terms of actual equipment we spent a good deal more on our jacketed conicals than we did on our little 40 gallon blichmanns. But 3bbl tanks are not much less than 7 bbl tanks which are not much less than 10 bbl tanks which are not much less than 15 bbl tanks.

Also, we probably spent 2Xs as much as Thirsty Monk on our initial build and he was putting out more beer in a month that we were our first quarter I highly encourage you to look at what he has done. I have stolen lots of ideas from him.). There are some really cheap methods of doing things if you look to frankenbuilding your equipment. And plastic conicals are extremely affordable and easy to rig. We bought 4 plastic 3 bbl conicals for as much as we paid for two 42 gallon blichmann conicals.

Maybe Thirsty has some ideas, but I have noooo idea where to source plastic conicals from around here. I would LOVE to find some, but so far, no dice, or they're not food-grade.
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Offline bonjour

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #172 on: January 06, 2012, 07:15:28 AM »
Very rarely do I here people talking about Flagship or house beers, one exception is if they are consistent award winners.

Specialty beers are what people talk about.  Specialty may be a big beer in a classic style, or Strawberry Shortcake (Shorts in MI)
The complete novelty of it captures attention.  These are what IMHO will get your brewery noticed.  IF you don't have the quality in your house beers to back these up, your patrons will pick up on it.
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Everything under 1.100 is a 'session' beer ;)

Offline bluesman

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #173 on: January 06, 2012, 07:51:56 AM »
Big highs and big lows. Recently I had a guy come up to me and tell me he liked all our specialty/seasonal beers. He didn't care at all for our flagship beers, but really loved our specialty beers.  ::)

Has your business stood up to your initial expectations (sales/operation)?

I'm sure there have been some adjustments, but has your business been relatively successful thus far?



Ron Price

Offline majorvices

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #174 on: January 06, 2012, 08:56:56 AM »
I was just bringing up a "for-instance" of highs and lows. Our flagship beers are our bread and butter and we can not keep up with demand and we have pubs waiting in line to take our beer on. I love our flagship beers. Mostly the business is "high" for me but you always have your detractors. It's awesome to have people tell you how much they love your beer but you are always going to have those who don't. It's part of the risk we run by not having a "gateway" beer in our line up. IPA, Belgian White and German Alt.

I guess if you are looking for a Porter or English ESB you are going to be disappointed.  ;) Our focus is on German and Belgian Ales and American IPAs.

Offline Thirsty_Monk

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #175 on: January 06, 2012, 06:04:15 PM »
Major I am happy to be an inspiration. 
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Offline majorvices

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #176 on: January 07, 2012, 04:39:24 AM »
Major I am happy to be an inspiration. 

And a model buddy! I wish I would have copied your set up when I first started! I think I started before you though so that would have been difficult. Still, really like what you did on your budget. Impressive set up and a good model for anyone trying to open a brewery on a shoe string budget.

Offline Thirsty_Monk

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #177 on: January 07, 2012, 07:01:59 AM »
Major I am happy to be an inspiration. 

And a model buddy! I wish I would have copied your set up when I first started! I think I started before you though so that would have been difficult. Still, really like what you did on your budget. Impressive set up and a good model for anyone trying to open a brewery on a shoe string budget.

Thank you for kind words.
You started your brewery before me so I was watching you  ;)

Just as a general note:
Different states have different rules and that will dictate how your brewery operate.
We are VERY successful in non traditional package.
We are operating in in plus territory for two reasons. 
Returnable packaging and self distribution.

As a small brewery you have to do something different then big boys.
Do not try to compete with them because you will never make it.
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Offline johnnyb

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #178 on: January 08, 2012, 11:04:57 AM »
I just heard back from the local brewery and am on the list to be considered for the next unpaid part-time apprenticeship opportunity. This might well be my only realistic chance to get a crack at brewing on a 7 barrel system (short of quitting my job and putting my family on the Ramon noodle diet) and might be helpful in the future to find investors if I do end up trying to start something myself. Now I need to convince them I'm the guy for this.

Offline Thirsty_Monk

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Re: Brewery Financing for someone with no wealth/collateral
« Reply #179 on: January 08, 2012, 02:36:15 PM »
Good job.
Enjoy.
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On Tap At The TapRoom:
Bohemian Pilsner
Bohemian Dark Lager
Smoked Bock
MaiBock
American Brown Ale
Marzen
Root beer