Author Topic: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please  (Read 1545 times)

Offline kmccaf

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Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« on: September 20, 2011, 04:38:27 PM »
So, I saw someone was brewing an Oatmeal Porter last week, and I thought that it sounded like it would hit the spot in a couple of weeks. I have never brewed a porter, so I was trying to keep it simple. However, I was wondering if this looked right, or if it could be improved upon. I was wondering what you all thought about adding some D-90 or D-180 candy syrup, or some Munich malt in there? As a note, I calculated it knowing that I didn’t get very good efficiency on my last brew, which was my first all-grain.


Oatmeal Porter (working recipe)

Fermentables

3 lbs Warminster Floor-Malted Maris Otter
10ozs Muntons Extra Light Malt Extract
8ozs Oats, Flaked
8ozs Simpsons Dark Crystal
8ozs Chocolate Malt (US) 

Hops

.5 oz Fuggles 4.2AA
1 oz Styrian Celeja  3.2AA

O.G.: 1.050
IBUS: 27.5
65% efficiency

WLP028--Edinburgh

So it goes.

Offline hokerer

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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2011, 06:26:15 PM »
Sure those amounts are right?  Or maybe it's a really small batch size?

In any case, probably no need for candy syrup in a porter.
Joe

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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2011, 06:59:17 PM »
Agree, for a 5 gallon batch off the top of my head you are looking at needing 5-6 lbs (or so) of DME - whate size batch are you brewing?

Agree that Belgian Candi syrup really would be out of place in a  porter. What you would work nicely if you bump up the DME or 2 row so it actually hits 1.050 for a 5 gallon beer.
Keith Y.
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jaybeerman

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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2011, 08:50:24 PM »
Historically porters were brewed with decent amounts of sugar(s); this notion that candi syrups would be out of place is ridiculous. Which candi syrup flavors were you looking to bring to the porter? Of course, clear syrup wouldn't bring any flavor just fermentables.  Brew whatever you want to brew, use what you want to use and don't worry about all the naysayers.

My standard porter contains neither oats nor candi syrup, but I've made amazing porters using both those ingredients.

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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2011, 06:19:01 AM »
Ridiculous??? I hardly think it is "ridiculous", I just think the flavors of Belgian Candi Syrup would remind me of a Dubbel, not a porter. Just like the raisin character of Special B stands out like a sore thumb in just about any non-belgian beer, to me at least. Doesn't matter what recipe it is in, if I taste special B I immediately think "belgian".

And, historic beers are kinda silly. Just because something was "historically" brewed one way doesn't mean it works today. Historically all beers were smoky and sour, that doesn't mean we should necessarily emulate that today. And if you wanna talk "histororic" I hardly think Porters used Belgian candi Syrup. That's not "historic" at all!

If you wanna add some sugar go with molasses or something that won't remind you of a belgian beer. That's my take on it, my recommendation - not cut in stone, not the arbiter of all things, but hardly "ridiculous" either.  ::)
« Last Edit: September 21, 2011, 06:22:36 AM by majorvices »
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Offline bluesman

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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2011, 06:32:40 AM »
I've seen some Porter recipes that use treacle syrup. It may be hard to come by but worth a try if you can get it. It will lend some dark fruit flavor to the beer.
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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2011, 06:35:53 AM »
Treacle is a good suggestion. Personally I like all malt porters, and I like Robust Porters (around 1.065) much better that low traditional or brown porters, but that's just me. People should experiment with what they want (including possibly candi syrup), not everyone has the same taste in beer.
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jaybeerman

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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2011, 08:15:45 AM »
Ridiculous??? I hardly think it is "ridiculous", I just think the flavors of Belgian Candi Syrup would remind me of a Dubbel, not a porter. Just like the raisin character of Special B stands out like a sore thumb in just about any non-belgian beer, to me at least. Doesn't matter what recipe it is in, if I taste special B I immediately think "belgian".
And, historic beers are kinda silly. Just because something was "historically" brewed one way doesn't mean it works today. Historically all beers were smoky and sour, that doesn't mean we should necessarily emulate that today. And if you wanna talk "histororic" I hardly think Porters used Belgian candi Syrup. That's not "historic" at all!
If you wanna add some sugar go with molasses or something that won't remind you of a belgian beer. That's my take on it, my recommendation - not cut in stone, not the arbiter of all things, but hardly "ridiculous" either.  ::)

Sorry I'm going to stick with “ridiculous.”  I'm trying not to be combative here, please don't be part of the trend to slap down any ingredient that doesn't fit into the cookie cutter definition of what a porter (or any other style) should be. Styles are born from experimentation and imagination.  While I don't personally use special b in my porter, it shows up in a ton of porter recipes.  Don't forget that your palate doesn't represent everyone's, just as mine doesn't.
What flavors come from candi syrup?  Let’s see; clear syrup = flavor neutral, amber syrup = mild caramel flavors, dark = vanilla/plum/raisin, dark2 = burnt sugar, figs, ripe fruit, toffee and dark chocolate.  There's a myriad of flavors to be had from the caramelization of sugar. I don't see any problem whatsoever with mild caramel, vanilla, burnt sugar, toffee or dark chocolate flavors in a porter.  The remaining flavors (plum, raisin, figs, and ripe fruit) in that list could just as easily come from fermentation byproduct (unless you're a wlp-001 fan).  I see plenty of room to add the syrup(s) without getting the raisin flavor.
You keep throwing around the phrase "Belgian candi syrup" but Belgian candi syrup is just sugar - like the sugar you add to your beers except that it's been caramelized.  I can take table sugar and make "Belgian candi syrup" on my stove.  Molasses is a by-product of sugar processing and while I personally think it's disgusting in beer, I guess I won’t say that you can can't add it to your porter if you like.  :)  In reality the "D2" syrup flavor should be an excellent approximation of the sugar that they would have historically added.

Seriously - I'm not trying to be combative.  :) cheers, j

edited to change the can to can't
« Last Edit: September 21, 2011, 09:33:05 AM by jaybeerman »

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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2011, 08:28:21 AM »
I think I outlined my position above well enough, that I don't think Belgian Candi syrup would go well in a Porter for the reasons I stated. Just like I would tell people that I don't think Special B goes well in a DoppelBock (yes, I've tried it). That doesn't mean I am saying you shouldn't experiment with those ingredients if you like. That certainly would be subject to ridicule.

But, giving one's opinion on what would taste right in any given beer should not be subject to ridicule. That is my opinion, based on my personal experiences. You and I may disagree, but that doesn't make either of our positions subject to ridicule.

So, had you simply said "I disagree" I would be totally understanding of your position. But saying someone's experience or opinion on something as subjective as a beer recipe is "ridiculous" is just going a bit overboard IMO.
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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2011, 08:30:15 AM »
I had given up on brewing porters.  I just started finding the "normal" flavor profile kinda boring.  Then I came up with a porter recipe that used Special B.  I loved it and my love of porters was rekindled.  The bottom line for me is that you should use anything that it takes to make the beer you have in mind.  Keith's last line in his last post "People should experiment with what they want (including possibly candi syrup), not everyone has the same taste in beer." pretty much sums up my philosophy.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2011, 08:32:23 AM by denny »
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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2011, 09:00:02 AM »
Keith, there’s a trend here and on every other brewing site.  Person A says, I'd like to experiment with these ingredients in this style of beer.  Person B says, "don't bother" or "that really would be out of place."  Rather a simple, "that might not be good for these reasons," might be better.  It's a pet peeve of mine.

In this case, I can't see why mild caramel, vanilla, burnt sugar, toffee or dark chocolate would be inappropriate in a porter.  I'd like to know why you think those flavors are inappropriate and I'll honestly respect your answer/opinion.

The bottom line for me is that you should use anything that it takes to make the beer you have in mind.  Keith's last line in his last post "People should experiment with what they want (including possibly candi syrup), not everyone has the same taste in beer." pretty much sums up my philosophy.

sounds good

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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2011, 09:09:38 AM »
^^^ That's where you should come in with your experiences. The thing that stuck in my craw was "ridiculous". I can totally see your point of view, I just don't agree that my opinion is "ridiculous".  ;)

Now, Special B in a porter ....  :P
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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2011, 09:42:23 AM »
That's where you should come in with your experiences.

"but I've made amazing porters using both those ingredients" doesn't do it for ya?  sorry it all ties into my plans to conquer the world

Offline kmccaf

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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2011, 09:44:28 AM »
Just to clarify, this is a 2.5 gallon batch. Sorry if it looked weird.

Regardless, I am loving the opinions here. The reason I was thinking some D-180 or D-90 would be good is because I was thinking the dark fruits, baker's chocolate, light coffee notes would go well in a porter. However, I was a little worried that it might dry out a beer like this where I was thinking of adding oats, or that it just sounded out of place in a porter.
So it goes.

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Re: Oatmeal Porter-Critique Please
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2011, 11:04:42 AM »
Now, Special B in a porter ....  :P

Dude, brew my Nick Danger porter recipe THEN tell me it's ridiculous!
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