[csu007]

So this will be my first attempt at an ESB. I'm shooting for some hybrid of Redhook's ESB, Lefthand's Sawtooth and NB 2below or better these are my favorite examples of this style
here is my draft. i'm open to changing any of the specialty malts and hops.

ETB-ESB
brewer logo
Added By: csu007
Method: Extract
Style: Extra Special/Strong Bitter (ESB)
Boil Time: 60 min
Batch Size: 5 gallons
Boil Size: 3 gallons
Efficiency: 70%
1.055
1.015
5.22%
38.46 (IBU)
11.35 (SRM)
Fermentables
Amount    Fermentable    PPG    °L    Bill %
6 lb   Liquid Malt Extract - Light   35   4   68.2%
Steeping Grains
Amount    Fermentable    PPG    °L    Bill %
0.5 lb   Biscuit   35   23   5.7%
0.5 lb   Victory   34   28   5.7%
1 lb   Amber   32   27   11.4%
0.3 lb   Caramel / Crystal 60L   34   60   3.4%
0.5 lb   ESB Malt   36   3.5   5.7%
Hops
Amount    Variety    Time    AA    Type    Use
1 oz   Fuggles   60 min   4.5   Pellet   Boil
0.5 oz   Fuggles   30 min   4.5   Pellet   Boil
0.5 oz   Fuggles   10 min   4.5   Pellet   Boil
0.5 oz   Goldings   60 min   4.5   Pellet   Boil
0.5 oz   Goldings   10 min   4.5   Pellet   Boil
1 oz   Pioneer   7 days   9   Pellet   Dry Hop
0.5 oz   Glacier   60 min   5.5   Pellet   Boil
0.5 oz   Glacier   25 min   5.5   Pellet   Boil
Other Ingredients
Amount    Name    Time    Type    Use
1 tsp   Irish Moss   15 min   Fining   Boil
Yeast
Fermentis / Safale - Safale - English Ale Yeast S-04
Attenuation (avg):
   72%    
Flocculation:
   Medium
Optimum Temperature:
   59°F - 75°F    
Starter:
   No

[ajk]

Looks like a pretty complex recipe, not that there's anything wrong with that.  Why the two different bittering hops, though; got some Glacier you want to use up? :-)

I've never tried the ESB Malt (Gambrinus, Google tells me?).  I wonder if that would contribute much when steeped.  I guess the market really needs a Maris Otter extract.

While S-04 is a great yeast, I don't think it will give you the diacetyl character of Red Hook, if that's one of the characteristics you're going for in your hybrid.

[csu007]

I have no reason for the ESB malt, minus the fact i saw it a couple of recipes i was looking at. the hops were just after looking online for hops that are better for the style. I thinking i could drop the ESB Malt and cut back the crystal (mostly for color and some sweetness to counter the biscuity/malty flavors)

[kmccaf]

Well, I think I would either take the Biscuit and Victory out, or take the Amber malt out. I think they are all too similar to have all three in there, and it would have an overwhelming biscuit taste. I would just pick one of those, and keep it under 10% of the grist. I am a big fan of all of those malts, and have made a beer with Biscuit and Amber, and it was a bit much for me. I just bottled a beer that was base malt and about 12% Amber malt, and the Amber gives the beer a very strong finish. I like it, but the point of that beer was to have the Amber malt dominate.

Other than that, I would simplify the hopping schedule (the varieties are all really good in an ESB though). For my ESBs, I like a schedule of 60, 15, 5 (dry hops are good as well). This seems to give me a really balanced dram, which is how I like my ESBs.

Hope that helps,
Kyle

[csu007]

thanks for the suggestions

should i keep the ESB malt and drop 2 the victory/amber/biscuit or just drop the ESB plus 2 of the VAB combo?

[gordonstrong]

Yeah, that was my observation.  Biscuit and Victory taste just about the same.  Amber adds a lot of that character too.  Unless you really like that flavor, I wouldn't use nearly that much of it.  Not sure what ESB malt is, but given its color, I'd check to see if it used the same flavor descriptors.

If I was using Maris Otter for the base, I don't know that I'd use much at all (maybe a quarter pound, if any). I think some of those grains give the bready, biscuity flavor that comes from a good English base malt.  However with a potentially neutral base malt flavor, you could go higher.

Going all the way back to early 1998, I checked one of my extract recipes for an ESB and saw that I used a half pound of victory.  So I think that's a decent level to start.

[csu007]

thanks for the suggestion, i think i will double check the esb malt and just go with one of the V/A/B malts

*Gambrinus ESB Pale (3-4°L)
This “Extra Special British” pale malt is malted for brewers seeking the unique flavor imparted by well-modified British malt.



   


   


   

[dak0415]

As a BIG fan of ESBs, my malt bills are pretty simple.  For an extract batch, the trick is getting the english malt character from LME/DME.  If you can get an english pale extract then use it, if not, as Gordon suggests, add some victory/biscuit 4-8 oz to get that "bready" character.  Next C60 is ok but if you can get some authentic british dark crystal (75L) that will make all the difference.  If you want a darker color add a little chocolate malt.  When I was doing extracts, I found that Northern Brewer, or its variants, for bittering was the best, fuggles @20min for flavor then dry-hop with an ounce for EKG.

My $.02

[csu007]

So i just looked online at my two LHBS's and neither of them sell Pioneer hops, would Progress hops be a could sub, according to BYO- online they say yes, but i was interested in what everyone here thinks?

also with an estimated OG 1.057 should I pitch 2 pkgs of dry yeast?

[thebigbaker]

If it's and 11.5 gram of yeast packet, then one packet should be enough.  You can always check here to see how much yeast you need:  http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html

[kylekohlmorgen]

The biggest problem I had when I started all-grain brewing was deciphering what each base and specialty malt brought to each beer. This was mostly because I never started with one base, tasted it, and adjusted with one specialty malt at a time.

Now I try to do this every time I start brewing a new style. ESB is PERFECT for this exercise. A 100% Maris Otter ESB is a great beer, especially with a solid amount of EKG flavor/aroma. Brew this first, taste it, bottle a few (for side-by-side comparisons), and decide what malt flavors you want more of. Then layer on one flavor at a time in future brews. They may not be your EXACT target, but they will be pretty good and you can never have enough ESB.

[kmccaf]

So i just looked online at my two LHBS's and neither of them sell Pioneer hops, would Progress hops be a could sub, according to BYO- online they say yes, but i was interested in what everyone here thinks?

also with an estimated OG 1.057 should I pitch 2 pkgs of dry yeast?

I've enjoyed Progress hops in a couple of beers. However, they were in an Extra Stout and an English Barleywine, so it is kind of difficult to decipher exactly what they brought to the beers. It should be a fine substitute. From your recipe, it looks like you are using them to dry hop. That said, if you have a lot of Goldings on hand, I would just use those for dry hopping, as I really like those as a dry hop.

[garc_mall]

That said, if you have a lot of Goldings on hand, I would just use those for dry hopping, as I really like those as a dry hop.

This! EKGs are awesome for dry hopping, I love the aroma.

[deepsouth]

i brewed an esb-ish beer over the weekend.  extract.  i used 3 lbs each of light and extra light malt, 1 lb c10, 12 oz biscuit, 4 oz special b and 4 oz special roast.  .25 oz apollo at 60, .25 oz apollo @ 30, .5 oz apollo and 1 oz citra at 15 and .75 oz apollo and 1 oz citra at flameout.  yeast was safale s-04.  not a ton of thought went into the recipe, so i hope it comes out ok.   i still have training wheels when it comes to brewing.

obviously not brewed to style....  i didn't have any esb type hops to use, so i went with what i had.  lots of late hop additions, another no no i know.  i tend to enjoy the hoppier side of beers down here in the heat of the summer.

[gordonstrong]

Taste it when it's done and decide what to call it.  Unless you're entering it in a competition, it's really not a big deal as long as you enjoy it.  It's just nice to be able to easily describe it to someone, that's all.  So if it's an "ESB with American hops" then someone should be able to figure it out.

If you still have your training wheels on, focus on making solid beer before you worry about making solid to-style beer.  It's a skill you'll always need.