Author Topic: wheat beer category  (Read 871 times)

Offline goschman

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wheat beer category
« on: October 29, 2015, 07:48:06 PM »
I entered this into 1D. American Wheat corresponding to the 2015 guidelines. My scores did not come back great because the judges thought it was misentered. Fortunately, the overall consensus was that they thought it was a good beer just not an American Wheat. From what I recall, it's malt character was too clean with not enough 'wheat' flavor. I cannot disagree and their comments made sense. I assume this is related to the actual malsters (grain types) that were used. It is very comparable to New Belgium's Sunshine Wheat for those that are familiar.

50% Pilsner
40% white wheat
10% flaked wheat

~20 IBU
Magnum - bittering
Cascade, Amarillo, Willamette - last 20 minutes of boil
Orange zest and coriander - last 5 minutes of boil

5% ABV
US-05

If this is not an American Wheat, what should it be? American Blonde? I don't necessarily plan to enter it again I am just a bit confused as to where it should fit.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2015, 07:53:46 PM by goschman »
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Offline goschman

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2015, 08:42:08 PM »
After looking through the guidelines again, this just may be one of those beers that doesn't fit although it should. If I upped the amount of wheat, and ditched the orange zest and coriander, it would probably fit more appropriately.

That still doesn't answer where I would enter this but I suppose if all else failed it could go into Specialty or SHV
« Last Edit: October 29, 2015, 08:45:05 PM by goschman »
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Offline reverseapachemaster

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2015, 08:45:16 PM »
Hard to say at 50% wheat it isn't wheat-y enough. I could maybe buy a miscategorization if the hop presence is too assertive and you were dinged for having too much hop and not enough wheat. The examples given in the guidelines are all pretty low on hop character. If this is what was described then maybe this sits better in American Pale. If it's not hoppy enough to compete in that category then maybe it sits best in a catchall as something nonsensical like a "session wheat ale" or something that lets people know to expect wheat but lots of hops as "session" has come to mean "low ABV high hops" in craft beer.
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Offline goschman

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2015, 09:05:22 PM »
Hard to say at 50% wheat it isn't wheat-y enough. I could maybe buy a miscategorization if the hop presence is too assertive and you were dinged for having too much hop and not enough wheat. The examples given in the guidelines are all pretty low on hop character. If this is what was described then maybe this sits better in American Pale. If it's not hoppy enough to compete in that category then maybe it sits best in a catchall as something nonsensical like a "session wheat ale" or something that lets people know to expect wheat but lots of hops as "session" has come to mean "low ABV high hops" in craft beer.

Makes sense. The late additions are 1/4 oz of hops at 20, 15, 10, 5 min so nothing crazy. I think you are right the hop presence as well as the noticeable zest and coriander probably overshadows the wheat.
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Offline jeffy

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2015, 12:13:37 AM »
Usually that category does not have added spices.  They throw it into the Witbier category, except that is also more yeast driven.  If the spice was at all noticible then it needs to be in SHV.
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Offline goschman

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2015, 02:18:22 AM »
Usually that category does not have added spices.  They throw it into the Witbier category, except that is also more yeast driven.  If the spice was at all noticible then it needs to be in SHV.

Yeah I took me a while to come to that conclusion above. I didn't think of SHV but I had another beer in that category so it would not have mattered. At least I know for the future.
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Offline chumley

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2015, 04:54:00 PM »
There are a lot more beer categories in real life than there are BJCP categories.  Your recipe looks like an American Wit, which is not a recognized style, yet there are numerous examples of them, among them Leinenkugel Sunset Wheat, Shocktop, Blue Moon, and, as you noted, Sunshine Wheat.  These basically are wits brewed with neutral yeast.  Sorry that this doesn't help, but maybe the BJCP will recognize them.

Offline rjharper

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2015, 05:00:40 PM »
Just because it contains 50% wheat in the grain bill doesn't mean it's going to be "wheaty enough". You're not judged on the grain bill, you're judged on flavor. If the final product is too clean, or wheat character doesnt come through, you'll get dinged.

Interesting side note, apparently 100% wheat beers drop very bright, attenuate highly and are very neutral. They'd probably be dinged for not wheaty enough too :)

Offline goschman

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2015, 05:41:19 PM »
There are a lot more beer categories in real life than there are BJCP categories.  Your recipe looks like an American Wit, which is not a recognized style, yet there are numerous examples of them, among them Leinenkugel Sunset Wheat, Shocktop, Blue Moon, and, as you noted, Sunshine Wheat.  These basically are wits brewed with neutral yeast.  Sorry that this doesn't help, but maybe the BJCP will recognize them.

No it helps.

I guess I am starting to realize that some of my beers that I think are solidly in a style are not actually. As long as I have been brewing, I still am influenced by what a brewery will call their beer. When I was younger, Sunshine Wheat and Odell Easy Street wheat were what I thought American Wheats were although I recognized the differences. It seems that Easy Street is probably the only one that is actually an American Wheat and there is less wiggle room than I realized. Sorry to use more regional examples...

For some reason, I have trouble categorizing my beers for competitions...not sure where my disconnect is because I do recognize you should enter it based on how it tastes more than anything.
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Offline JJeffers09

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2015, 10:05:17 PM »
+1 to the American Pale Ale.  That is really close to being a good Wheat IPA like Blue Moons White IPA, If it was more bitter that would probably fair well. The down side is that is not bitter enough to fit IPA or and again +1 to not enough Wheat. 

If it had another oz of a noble hop to carry it into a Wheat-y IPA.  Although I don't like Bitter beers, like IPA, cause I am weird and against the grain I guess.  SO I am saying your beer sounds GREAT to me...
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Offline brewday

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2015, 10:42:50 PM »
I guess I am starting to realize that some of my beers that I think are solidly in a style are not actually. As long as I have been brewing, I still am influenced by what a brewery will call their beer. When I was younger, Sunshine Wheat and Odell Easy Street wheat were what I thought American Wheats were although I recognized the differences. It seems that Easy Street is probably the only one that is actually an American Wheat and there is less wiggle room than I realized. Sorry to use more regional examples...

For some reason, I have trouble categorizing my beers for competitions...not sure where my disconnect is because I do recognize you should enter it based on how it tastes more than anything.

Even though I've gone over them time and time again, I still reference books like DGB, BCS and MHR if I'm really trying to nail down style.  This goes for both recipe formulation before brewing as well as sensory evaluation after.
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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #11 on: October 30, 2015, 10:54:12 PM »
Even though I've gone over them time and time again, I still reference books like DGB, BCS and MHR if I'm really trying to nail down style.  This goes for both recipe formulation before brewing as well as sensory evaluation after.

For sure. They're reference books you can trust to at least get you in the ballpark. I learned a TON from DGB.
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Offline goschman

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2015, 02:16:37 AM »
+1 to the American Pale Ale.  That is really close to being a good Wheat IPA like Blue Moons White IPA, If it was more bitter that would probably fair well. The down side is that is not bitter enough to fit IPA or and again +1 to not enough Wheat. 

If it had another oz of a noble hop to carry it into a Wheat-y IPA.  Although I don't like Bitter beers, like IPA, cause I am weird and against the grain I guess.  SO I am saying your beer sounds GREAT to me...

It's not even close to an American pale ale. It tastes like its 20 IBUs. The American Wit as suggested earlier is the best description but it would fit best in the SHV category it seems. I believe my score was around 30 in the American wheat category.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2015, 02:29:56 AM by goschman »
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Offline brewinhard

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Re: wheat beer category
« Reply #13 on: October 31, 2015, 06:23:51 PM »
Maybe a different yeast would help to not make it so "clean" in the finished product. As mentioned above, the spices are out of place for this style (American Wheat) and an American wheat yeast might be more appropriate leaving behind that classic haze for a bit longer than US-O5 would as well as providing some more "wheat beer" like character (albeit subtle).