[a10t2]

Ignore me, im at the bottom of a magnum of Elevation-False Summit. Freeby 11% barrel aged quad I brought home from Best of Craft. Long story...

Dang, they're in Oregon now? Awesome.

[klickitat jim]

Ignore me, im at the bottom of a magnum of Elevation-False Summit. Freeby 11% barrel aged quad I brought home from Best of Craft. Long story...

Dang, they're in Oregon now? Awesome.

No, they entered it at a competition and I scored a leftover bottle

[RPIScotty]

Blondes: My stance is that it's a bit annoying and old school. I don't think it's doing anything to make craft beer more inclusive towards women.

All I could think about was doing a blonde ale and making it some sort of Adonis type guy on it in a parody of a sexy pose, or an overweight guy in a bikini or something.

I'm not that familiar with pod casts, this is actually the first one I ever listened to, but is there a way to like preload/buffer/download them so I can listen to them in the car without having to use all my data? I have a long-ish commute and usually do audiobooks but some podcasts would be a nice change of pace occasionally. I only got about 40% into the episode before my buffered portion was used up.

I use the Podcasts app on my IPhone.

[RPIScotty]

To be clear, I support Drew's right to the position and im not worked up about it. I just personally disagree that its a problem. Plus its always more interesting to discuss things we disagree on, usually.

I still agree with you Jim.

This isn't about social or economic equality. It's beer. The onus is not on the "craft" beer community to be inclusive to men or women. If you like good beer then you drink it. If you don't, or feel excluded by a certain company, then vote with your dollars.

There is an intermingling of ideas here that doesn't seem valid.

[Stevie]

I gotta say I disagree with you two regarding the "pink washing."

First, you are miss using the term. Pink washing is when a company dons a pink ribbon in support of breast cancer when their products may be linked to causing breast cancer. An example would be BP advertising support for breast cancer awareness month.

Secondly, you mentioned that many of the women you know prefer IPAs. I don't doubt this, but you live in a niche sub market where the women (and men) are far more educated when it comes to beer. In many groups these beers are predominately enjoyed by women and a brewer would be a fool to not capitalize on that.

I was at a growler bar in Dallas a couple of years back. When we arrived there were two women, maybe mid-twenties filling their growlers with Blood and Honey (an Am Wheat with blood orange zest, spices and honey). I little while later another woman had her growler filled with the same. When we left, my wife had her growler filled with the same. I noticed this everywhere. Non-craft beer ladies would drink this beer when it was available. This brewery didn't market towards women overtly, but from what I could see, it was more popular with women than men.

This reminds me of a time when my college roommate complained about the number of country stations on the radio. "Nobody listens to country anymore." Nobody in his microcosm of existence, but in many areas country is huge.

Solid episode. I have a little left to finish on my commute this morning.

[tommymorris]

If you wanna keep my baby mama happy your gonna need to brew some cider. Just saying.

I agree the double D blonde ales of the world will likely offend a big portion of the beer market. I am not a big fan of that sort of thing myself especially because I won't subject my wife to such an establishment.

Last but not least: Blonde Ales are for men. Every other beer I brew is a blonde ale. I like them and I do not apologize for it.

[denny]

I gotta say I disagree with you two regarding the "pink washing."

First, you are miss using the term. Pink washing is when a company dons a pink ribbon in support of breast cancer when their products may be linked to causing breast cancer. An example would be BP advertising support for breast cancer awareness month.

Secondly, you mentioned that many of the women you know prefer IPAs. I don't doubt this, but you live in a niche sub market where the women (and men) are far more educated when it comes to beer. In many groups these beers are predominately enjoyed by women and a brewer would be a fool to not capitalize on that.

I was at a growler bar in Dallas a couple of years back. When we arrived there were two women, maybe mid-twenties filling their growlers with Blood and Honey (an Am Wheat with blood orange zest, spices and honey). I little while later another woman had her growler filled with the same. When we left, my wife had her growler filled with the same. I noticed this everywhere. Non-craft beer ladies would drink this beer when it was available. This brewery didn't market towards women overtly, but from what I could see, it was more popular with women than men.

This reminds me of a time when my college roommate complained about the number of country stations on the radio. "Nobody listens to country anymore." Nobody in his microcosm of existence, but in many areas country is huge.

Solid episode. I have a little left to finish on my commute this morning.

Are you sure _you're_ not in the niche market? 

[dbeechum]

Stevie, you're right - I mentioned earlier that I didn't get to really talk about pinkwashing properly. That annoys the crap out of me. My problem with pinkwashing is that's almost always a cheap, cynical bulls*** move to appear like there's positive change. I also shake my head that it works for enough folks to make it effective. I worry (this is the main thing Jim and RPI) that both pinkwashing and the crappy cheap inneundo / old school head pat stuff will continue to undermine the adoption of our favorite thing and I'll still have to sit here 20 years from now going "beer isn't just about dumb bro dudes searching for the latest hop bomb as an excuse to get hammered".

Here's the rub for me and what drives my philosophy about all things - it's not just feminism or anything else - so consider this Drew's Rule of Life..

The world is a crappy place and everyone's having a hard time. The least I can do is not, as much as possible, add to it. It's a small price for me to pay to avoid exclusionary language and images in the things I create and push. I'm not perfect at it. Who is? But damnit, I'm going to try, get it wrong, learn to adjust and keep moving.

This may also explain why when people, who are used to reading my writing or listening to me banter with Denny,
meet me seem surprised at how little biting humor I use - until I know you.

[denny]

This may also explain why when people, who are used to reading my writing or listening to me banter with Denny,
meet me seem surprised at how little biting humor I use - until I know you.

But once he does, you get the full treatment!

[theDarkSide]

This may also explain why when people, who are used to reading my writing or listening to me banter with Denny,
meet me seem surprised at how little biting humor I use - until I know you.

But once he does, you get the full treatment!

I've met Drew a couple times and he hasn't bitten me yet.  Do I need him to smell my hand first?

(ok...it's late in the day on Friday and I don't want to be at work anymore )

[RPIScotty]

Stevie, you're right - I mentioned earlier that I didn't get to really talk about pinkwashing properly. That annoys the crap out of me. My problem with pinkwashing is that's almost always a cheap, cynical bulls*** move to appear like there's positive change. I also shake my head that it works for enough folks to make it effective. I worry (this is the main thing Jim and RPI) that both pinkwashing and the crappy cheap inneundo / old school head pat stuff will continue to undermine the adoption of our favorite thing and I'll still have to sit here 20 years from now going "beer isn't just about dumb bro dudes searching for the latest hop bomb as an excuse to get hammered".

Here's the rub for me and what drives my philosophy about all things - it's not just feminism or anything else - so consider this Drew's Rule of Life..

The world is a crappy place and everyone's having a hard time. The least I can do is not, as much as possible, add to it. It's a small price for me to pay to avoid exclusionary language and images in the things I create and push. I'm not perfect at it. Who is? But damnit, I'm going to try, get it wrong, learn to adjust and keep moving.

This may also explain why when people, who are used to reading my writing or listening to me banter with Denny,
meet me seem surprised at how little biting humor I use - until I know you.

Understood.

I have a better grasp on your position now. Your advocating NOT judging this stuff on a scale of severity but rather exercising it completely from your list of acceptable behavior.

[dbeechum]

Your advocating NOT judging this stuff on a scale of severity but rather exercising it completely from your list of acceptable behavior.

I don't know why but saying "acceptable" makes me feel harsher than i think my position is.

Of course, my position is also defined by a sort of wearied exhaustion with it all, like "really? We're still doing this? How can it be good to be putting a good portion of half your potential market in a position to feel objectified or condescended to?" It can be viewed either from a market/business pov or a basic humanness stance.

Really, all I'm trying to encourage is for everyone to feel welcome to enjoy the warm loving embrace of a good cold beer.

[RPIScotty]

Your advocating NOT judging this stuff on a scale of severity but rather exercising it completely from your list of acceptable behavior.

I don't know why but saying "acceptable" makes me feel harsher than i think my position is.

I think usong the word acceptable here is totally acceptable!