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Author Topic: BIAB Grain Rinse  (Read 5537 times)

Offline Megary

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #30 on: April 26, 2020, 01:11:19 pm »
I brewed an APA today.  I didn't crush as fine as usual but I did "thin the mash" by planning for a 90 minute boil. I had a water:grist ratio of .83.

I got 76.8% which is about 5 points better than what I normally get.  Admittedly, one brew means very little and no doubt there could have been other factors at play.  At the very least, for me and my set up, it's worth a longer look.

Offline denny

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #31 on: April 26, 2020, 01:42:43 pm »
I found my efficiency increased when I went to a thinner mash.
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Big Monk

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #32 on: April 26, 2020, 01:49:06 pm »
I brewed an APA today.  I didn't crush as fine as usual but I did "thin the mash" by planning for a 90 minute boil. I had a water:grist ratio of .83.

I got 76.8% which is about 5 points better than what I normally get.  Admittedly, one brew means very little and no doubt there could have been other factors at play.  At the very least, for me and my set up, it's worth a longer look.

Call me crazy but I would never want to increase my boil time to get my gravity higher. I would just add more grain.

I guess I still don’t understand the end game. Are you trying to up your efficiency?

Offline Megary

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #33 on: April 26, 2020, 02:47:34 pm »
I brewed an APA today.  I didn't crush as fine as usual but I did "thin the mash" by planning for a 90 minute boil. I had a water:grist ratio of .83.

I got 76.8% which is about 5 points better than what I normally get.  Admittedly, one brew means very little and no doubt there could have been other factors at play.  At the very least, for me and my set up, it's worth a longer look.

Call me crazy but I would never want to increase my boil time to get my gravity higher. I would just add more grain.

I guess I still don’t understand the end game. Are you trying to up your efficiency?

I’m just trying to figure out what a good grist ratio range for (my) BIAB is. Understanding the process. That’s all.

I’m thinking this will be more important on the high gravity end (less water).  My Mash tachometer! The ratio will have a red line at some point where I’ll know I’m pushing too hard - efficiency will noticeably fall off and I’ll know at that point it’s time to consider sugar/extract to help move the gravity upwards. It should help in recipe design.

That will require many brew days to figure out. All in the name of science.  I’ll get there.

Offline BrewBama

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #34 on: April 26, 2020, 04:05:36 pm »
I found my efficiency increased when I went to a thinner mash.
I did as well.


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Big Monk

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #35 on: April 26, 2020, 05:31:35 pm »
I brewed an APA today.  I didn't crush as fine as usual but I did "thin the mash" by planning for a 90 minute boil. I had a water:grist ratio of .83.

I got 76.8% which is about 5 points better than what I normally get.  Admittedly, one brew means very little and no doubt there could have been other factors at play.  At the very least, for me and my set up, it's worth a longer look.

Call me crazy but I would never want to increase my boil time to get my gravity higher. I would just add more grain.

I guess I still don’t understand the end game. Are you trying to up your efficiency?

I’m just trying to figure out what a good grist ratio range for (my) BIAB is. Understanding the process. That’s all.

I’m thinking this will be more important on the high gravity end (less water).  My Mash tachometer! The ratio will have a red line at some point where I’ll know I’m pushing too hard - efficiency will noticeably fall off and I’ll know at that point it’s time to consider sugar/extract to help move the gravity upwards. It should help in recipe design.

That will require many brew days to figure out. All in the name of science.  I’ll get there.

What are you using for software?

Offline Megary

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #36 on: April 26, 2020, 06:36:39 pm »
I brewed an APA today.  I didn't crush as fine as usual but I did "thin the mash" by planning for a 90 minute boil. I had a water:grist ratio of .83.

I got 76.8% which is about 5 points better than what I normally get.  Admittedly, one brew means very little and no doubt there could have been other factors at play.  At the very least, for me and my set up, it's worth a longer look.

Call me crazy but I would never want to increase my boil time to get my gravity higher. I would just add more grain.

I guess I still don’t understand the end game. Are you trying to up your efficiency?

I’m just trying to figure out what a good grist ratio range for (my) BIAB is. Understanding the process. That’s all.

I’m thinking this will be more important on the high gravity end (less water).  My Mash tachometer! The ratio will have a red line at some point where I’ll know I’m pushing too hard - efficiency will noticeably fall off and I’ll know at that point it’s time to consider sugar/extract to help move the gravity upwards. It should help in recipe design.

That will require many brew days to figure out. All in the name of science.  I’ll get there.

What are you using for software?

I have a spreadsheet that uses calculations based on Palmer for gravity, volumes, ibu's, color.  I double check this against Brewer's Friend and use their software for water...which I often double check vs. B'nW.
Despite the longer boil today, volumes were spot on.  Very happy with that.

Big Monk

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #37 on: April 26, 2020, 09:44:31 pm »
I brewed an APA today.  I didn't crush as fine as usual but I did "thin the mash" by planning for a 90 minute boil. I had a water:grist ratio of .83.

I got 76.8% which is about 5 points better than what I normally get.  Admittedly, one brew means very little and no doubt there could have been other factors at play.  At the very least, for me and my set up, it's worth a longer look.

Call me crazy but I would never want to increase my boil time to get my gravity higher. I would just add more grain.

I guess I still don’t understand the end game. Are you trying to up your efficiency?

I’m just trying to figure out what a good grist ratio range for (my) BIAB is. Understanding the process. That’s all.

I’m thinking this will be more important on the high gravity end (less water).  My Mash tachometer! The ratio will have a red line at some point where I’ll know I’m pushing too hard - efficiency will noticeably fall off and I’ll know at that point it’s time to consider sugar/extract to help move the gravity upwards. It should help in recipe design.

That will require many brew days to figure out. All in the name of science.  I’ll get there.

What are you using for software?

I have a spreadsheet that uses calculations based on Palmer for gravity, volumes, ibu's, color.  I double check this against Brewer's Friend and use their software for water...which I often double check vs. B'nW.
Despite the longer boil today, volumes were spot on.  Very happy with that.

This discussion really hinges on volume. Since WtG ratio is a function of 2 variables, if you keep the ratio constant, both variables need to increase. That’s fine for grain but you can’t keep volume constant as grain increases or you’ll encounter more volume than desired.

Obviously as gravity increases, volume would have to increase as well to keep the “desired” WtG ratio. You could combat this by boiling more or just dumping the remainder of the wort you don’t need, although the former is a waste of time (and possible stress point for the wort) and the latter is just wasteful.

What is more likely true for you is that a range exists across beers of varying gravity where you encounter good efficiency and extraction. However, I doubt if a universal value exists for you.

Best of luck!

Offline goose

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #38 on: April 27, 2020, 07:45:17 am »
I found my efficiency increased when I went to a thinner mash.
I did as well.


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+1

I went from about 1.2-1.3 quarts/lb of grain to 1.5 and had a noticeable increase in efficiency.  I tried this based on what I read on t his forum some time ago and I figured I had nothing to lose since water is cheap.  I also used to mash my ESB at 1 quart/lb based on Ray Daniel's recommendations in "Designing Great Beers" and my efficiency was not that great.  When I thinned the mash to 1.5 quarts/lb it came up from around 70% to over 80%.
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Big Monk

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #39 on: April 27, 2020, 07:55:26 am »
I found my efficiency increased when I went to a thinner mash.
I did as well.


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+1

I went from about 1.2-1.3 quarts/lb of grain to 1.5 and had a noticeable increase in efficiency.  I tried this based on what I read on t his forum some time ago and I figured I had nothing to lose since water is cheap.  I also used to mash my ESB at 1 quart/lb based on Ray Daniel's recommendations in "Designing Great Beers" and my efficiency was not that great.  When I thinned the mash to 1.5 quarts/lb it came up from around 70% to over 80%.

I think the only distinction to make here is as opposed to you, Denny and BrewBama, Megary is essentially a no-sparge brewer, so water to grain ratio is fixed in that case.

Where as a batch sparge brewer has the opportunity to remove or add sparge water based on their initial mash, someone like me or Megary for instance, can't do that.

An incremental change to water to grain ratio for a sparger means a thinner initial mash and more efficient first runnings with the possibility to just sparge with less, where as a no-sparge brewer would see that present itself as simply more up front volume and subsequently more back end volume. Which is of course part of what Megary is driving at with this post.

I agree 1000% percent on thinner mashes being more efficient, however, and i'm not afraid in my brewer to go very thin, so much so that I don't even track water to grain ratio at all. It just is what it is.

Offline BrewBama

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Re: BIAB Grain Rinse
« Reply #40 on: April 27, 2020, 08:28:22 am »
You can still mash thinner if your MLT or kettle can handle it. Just boil longer to evaporate more.


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