[yso191]

I finally got around to brewing a Pale Ale that I wanted to do for some time.  There were in essence two new factors that I wanted to experiment with.

First I wanted to try Summit hops for two reasons.  First they were said to give an onion or garlic flavor when used for bittering.  Someone on this forum stated that he never got that when using them as a 20 minute addition, and second, that they contributed to a tangerine or mandarin orange flavor when used this way.

The second new factor is that I had not tried Mandarina Bavaria hops before, and they too were said to contribute a dominant mandarin orange / tangerine flavor.

The beer turned out good.  My daughter said it was the best beer I have brewed.

No one picked up any onion or garlic flavors, so that is a win.  However, no one picked up any mandarin orange or tangerine flavors!  A bust there.  Obviously I am looking for it, but there is a medium intensity orange aroma to the beer.  I can also taste orange a bit, but again that could be because I know it is there.  Again, no one who tries it blind identifies anything orangey.

Here is the recipe I used:

Tangerine Dream Bar (Hah!)
American Pale Ale (10 A)
OG: 1.049 / FG 1.004
Batch Size: 6.50 gal

9 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM)  78.3 %
1 lbs 8.0 oz Munich Malt (10.0 SRM)   13.0 %
1 lbs White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM)       8.7 %

1.00 oz Summit [17.00 %] - Boil 20.0 min  32.0 IBUs

3.00 oz Mandarina Bavaria [8.10 %] - 30 minute hop stand @ 170*
1.0 pkg Safale American (DCL/Fermentis #US-05)
5.00 oz Mandarina Bavaria [8.50 %] - Dry Hop 5.0 Days

[Iliff Ave]

Sounds great! I have not used Summit myself due the reasons that you noted. I have had commercial beers that used Summit though and have never noticed the garlic/onion thing. 

[hopfenundmalz]

Best you have brewed, but no orange/tangerine. Is that a win or fail? No garlic/onion is a win!

[yso191]

Best you have brewed, but no orange/tangerine. Is that a win or fail? No garlic/onion is a win!

I don't think it is the best I have brewed - my daughter said that.  It's good but I've brewed several I like better.

No it is a win overall, just disappointed in the lack of flavor carry-over vis. the hops.

[HoosierBrew]

 As for the flavor I'd boost the Mandarina stand by 2-3 oz for that size batch -  I love it but find it mild in comparison to IPA hops. Hell, sounds good anyway !

EDIT - Just saw that you picked up on a medium orange aroma. My bad.

[hopfenundmalz]

Best you have brewed, but no orange/tangerine. Is that a win or fail? No garlic/onion is a win!

I don't think it is the best I have brewed - my daughter said that.  It's good but I've brewed several I like better.

No it is a win overall, just disappointed in the lack of flavor carry-over vis. the hops.

The one I made with mandarina had a lot of mandarin Orange aroma and flavor. It was similar to your recipe, but those were hops from the year before last. Crop variation?

I might have to look at the amounts I used.

[Steve Ruch]

First I wanted to try Summit hops for two reasons.  First they were said to give an onion or garlic flavor when used for bittering. 

I read somewhere that the onion came from when the hops were harvested and summits harvested at an earlier (later? not sure) time gave off no onion aspects.

[yso191]

First I wanted to try Summit hops for two reasons.  First they were said to give an onion or garlic flavor when used for bittering. 

I read somewhere that the onion came from when the hops were harvested and summits harvested at an earlier (later? not sure) time gave off no onion aspects.

I have also heard this with respect to this hop and others (Citra, etc.).

[mabrungard]

One of my clients recently put a new Saison in their lineup and I had noted that it was overly piney, but very tasty. When I mentioned this to the brewer, he told me there was no Simcoe or Chinook that I had suspected. He floored me when he told me it was 100% Mandarina Bavaria for all additions. It didn't come across orangey or citrusy to me. Very strange, but add this to your database.

[chumley]

Martin, that's interesting.  Reminds me of Sorachi Ace.  After trying the Brooklyn Brewery Saison and told that the lemony flavor in it was from the use of Sorachi Ace, I went and bought a pound of it and brewed several pale ales and saisons with it.  To date, I have never got any lemony character out of them.  If anything, I find them to be more like English dirt hops.

Sorry for the thread hijack.  Back on track, I always thought Amarillo gives a nice tangerine flavor, especially in summer blonde session beers.

[beersk]

Martin, that's interesting.  Reminds me of Sorachi Ace.  After trying the Brooklyn Brewery Saison and told that the lemony flavor in it was from the use of Sorachi Ace, I went and bought a pound of it and brewed several pale ales and saisons with it.  To date, I have never got any lemony character out of them.  If anything, I find them to be more like English dirt hops.

Sorry for the thread hijack.  Back on track, I always thought Amarillo gives a nice tangerine flavor, especially in summer blonde session beers.

I've had poor luck with Amarillo. I think the 2013 crop was bad...

I'm about to brew a Pilsner with Mandarina Bavaria...looking forward to it.

[curtism1234]

The one I made with mandarina had a lot of mandarin Orange aroma and flavor.

That has been my 2 experiences with Mandarina as well