[Iliff Ave]

I'm very confused here. A smoother more approachable beer doesn't make it a better stout if you're not hitting the style characteristics. Hasn't it been established that it drinks more like a big brown ale not an imperial stout? To me it sounds like you just don't like imperial stout as much as your beer. I know it's a bummer but maybe you can't expect to get 1st place for every beer you make...

[Bel Air Brewing]

I'm very confused here. A smoother more approachable beer doesn't make it a better stout if you're not hitting the style characteristics. Hasn't it been established that it drinks more like a big brown ale not an imperial stout? To me it sounds like you just don't like imperial stout as much as your beer. I know it's a bummer but maybe you can't expect to get 1st place for every beer you make...

You and I are apparantly both confused. I am trying to fully understand what an Imperial Stout really is. My particular entry is not even close to the Big Brown Ale BJCP category.

Here are the Imperial Stout BJCP style numbers:

IBU - 50 - 90

SRM - 30 - 40

OG - 1.075 - 1.115

FG - 1.018 - 1.030

ABV - 8% - 12%

Here is what our final numbers came in at:

OG - 1.093

FG - 1.017

ABV - 10%

IBU - 55

SRM - 35

My example was on the lower end of the acceptable range for IBU's.

[Iliff Ave]

The recipe is the key here not your numbers. You had a low amount of roasted barley which is a hallmark of the style. One of the judges notes was that it needed more roasted character hence the big brown ale comments. Seems pretty straightforward to me.

[Bel Air Brewing]

The recipe is the key here not your numbers. You had a low amount of roasted barley which is a hallmark of the style. One of the judges notes was that it needed more roasted character hence the big brown ale comments. Seems pretty straightforward to me.

Here is the info from the score sheet:

Flavor - "Smooth chocolate malt flavor. Not much bitterness & some malt sweetness. Roast is the primary flavor."

            "Good combination of malt character & bitterness. Clean fermentation."

Mouthfeel - "Body is fairly full. Medium carbonation."
             
                "Fairly big beer. Good carbonation, and a bit of warming. Not astringent. Good."

[Iliff Ave]

What about these notes in your first post? These don't count because they don't support your opinion?
"A nice beer with a good overall finish. Could use more body. Too light for the style"

"Good beer. Should be darker. Kick up the roast for this style. This beer is between a Big Brown Ale, and a Stout"

Just trying to help with some basic advice. I guess you don't need it. Good luck

[Bel Air Brewing]

What about these notes in your first post? These don't count because they don't support your opinion?
"A nice beer with a good overall finish. Could use more body. Too light for the style"

"Good beer. Should be darker. Kick up the roast for this style. This beer is between a Big Brown Ale, and a Stout"

Just trying to help with some basic advice. I guess you don't need it. Good luck

I need all the help I can get, thus the questions that are raised here.

All of the comments posted were directly from the score sheets. It seems there is a slight contradiction here. See post #63. Roast is the primary flavor.

[denny]

It has aged a full year now. And even though the judges gave it a composite score of 34 points, it is actually a very good stout. And it hits the BJCP numbers for the style. Yes, I agree with Denny that beer is more than numbers. But the numbers are important, none the less.

b-but i don't have any numbers... ?

maybe i could start making some scores for my beers?

You have the kind of numbers I was referring to....OG, FG, SRM, IBU, etc.

[denny]

I know this is a single data point, and highly subjective. My wife and I did a side-by-side taste test of Old Rasputin vs my version of Imperial Stout.

We both agreed, ours is far more approachable & drinkable. A smoother, less "in your face" type of beer.

If we were in a bar ordering a stout with a choice between these two, I would select the one from Bel Air Brewing.

It has aged a full year now. And even though the judges gave it a composite score of 34 points, it is actually a very good stout. And it hits the BJCP numbers for the style. Yes, I agree with Denny that beer is more than numbers. But the numbers are important, none the less.

I do not say this because we brewed it. I just gave away 10 gallons of Vienna that was not very good. We entered several Vienna Lagers in the comp, one did very well, and two did poorly. Amazingly, this Vienna was well received by those who are drinking it now. But they are not BJCP rated, so what do they know?

I'm sure you have a very good beer, but that fact that you prefer it has nothing to do with a BJCP comp. A beer comp is all about duplicating a reference beer. It is not about preferences.

[denny]

I'm very confused here. A smoother more approachable beer doesn't make it a better stout if you're not hitting the style characteristics. Hasn't it been established that it drinks more like a big brown ale not an imperial stout? To me it sounds like you just don't like imperial stout as much as your beer. I know it's a bummer but maybe you can't expect to get 1st place for every beer you make...

You and I are apparantly both confused. I am trying to fully understand what an Imperial Stout really is. My particular entry is not even close to the Big Brown Ale BJCP category.

Here are the Imperial Stout BJCP style numbers:

IBU - 50 - 90

SRM - 30 - 40

OG - 1.075 - 1.115

FG - 1.018 - 1.030

ABV - 8% - 12%

Here is what our final numbers came in at:

OG - 1.093

FG - 1.017

ABV - 10%

IBU - 55

SRM - 35

My example was on the lower end of the acceptable range for IBU's.

Once again, you're are confusing numbers with perception. Yiu could hit those numbers in a variety of ways, but that would not necessarily make it an imperial stout.

[Iliff Ave]

Quite the conundrum here. Sometimes I post looking for feedback but then ignore the feedback I get. Seems similar here.

[Bel Air Brewing]

Quite the conundrum here. Sometimes I post looking for feedback but then ignore the feedback I get. Seems similar here.

Quite frankly, I'm seeking help in determining what this beer actually is. If it is not an Imperial Stout, then what is it?

And we know it's not a Big Brown Ale.

Any advice offered will be fully considered. A recipe was provided earlier, and we will brew that. But only after a thorough forensic analysis is finished here.

Thanks for all of your input!

[kramerog]

Quite frankly, I'm seeking help in determining what this beer actually is. If it is not an Imperial Stout, then what is it?

It seems that your doesn't really fit into any specific BJCP category or a specific panel of judge's interpretation of RIS. Plenty of good beers don't match BJCP style guidelines.  The guidelines exist so that as much as possible apple-to-apple comparisons can be made instead of apple-to-orange ones in beer competitions.

[denny]

Quite the conundrum here. Sometimes I post looking for feedback but then ignore the feedback I get. Seems similar here.

Quite frankly, I'm seeking help in determining what this beer actually is. If it is not an Imperial Stout, then what is it?

And we know it's not a Big Brown Ale.

Any advice offered will be fully considered. A recipe was provided earlier, and we will brew that. But only after a thorough forensic analysis is finished here.

Thanks for all of your input!

Why does it have to fit any category at all?  Many beers don't.

[Big_Eight]

Quite the conundrum here. Sometimes I post looking for feedback but then ignore the feedback I get. Seems similar here.

Quite frankly, I'm seeking help in determining what this beer actually is. If it is not an Imperial Stout, then what is it?

And we know it's not a Big Brown Ale.

Any advice offered will be fully considered. A recipe was provided earlier, and we will brew that. But only after a thorough forensic analysis is finished here.

Thanks for all of your input!

Why does it have to fit any category at all?  Many beers don't.

After reading a bit of beer history I've learned that the BJCP Guidelines are merely that guidelines. Unless you are hell bent on competition styles beer can go any way you want it.

I like to brew the way that tastes the best to me but I don't enter competition or care about them for that matter.

I'm brewing a 1910 dark mild right now from a historical book that wouldn't fit in the category of a dark mild by today's standards.

[Bel Air Brewing]

Quite the conundrum here. Sometimes I post looking for feedback but then ignore the feedback I get. Seems similar here.

Quite frankly, I'm seeking help in determining what this beer actually is. If it is not an Imperial Stout, then what is it?

And we know it's not a Big Brown Ale.

Any advice offered will be fully considered. A recipe was provided earlier, and we will brew that. But only after a thorough forensic analysis is finished here.

Thanks for all of your input!

Why does it have to fit any category at all?  Many beers don't.

After reading a bit of beer history I've learned that the BJCP Guidelines are merely that guidelines. Unless you are hell bent on competition styles beer can go any way you want it.

I like to brew the way that tastes the best to me but I don't enter competition or care about them for that matter.

I'm brewing a 1910 dark mild right now from a historical book that wouldn't fit in the category of a dark mild by today's standards.

Honestly, never really thought about beers that do not fit a category! Early in my brewing career, I would just whip up a recipe on my own, with a little guidance from a graduate of the Siebel Institute, who was also the brewmaster at a local Hofbrau brewpub. The only goal was to brew a good beer, and one that was drinkable / likable.

Competitions were not even a consideration.

And I will get back into brewing beer just for fun, without concerns for the BJCP rules. I do enjoy the challenge, however.

Thanks again for your input.