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Author Topic: Dry Yeast Starter  (Read 1913 times)

Offline HopDen

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Dry Yeast Starter
« on: May 12, 2023, 03:43:21 pm »
Apparently the rule is that you don't need to make a starter when using dry yeast ( I never have) but I am shy 1 package. 15 gallon batch. 1.052 OG Need 3 packs but only have 2. Making 2 one liter SNS starters w/11g sachets. Anyone see a possible issue?

Offline Frankenbrew

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #1 on: May 12, 2023, 03:53:24 pm »
"Tis a myth! Go ahead and make a 1 liter vitality starter!
Frank C.

And thereof comes the proverb: 'Blessing of your
heart, you brew good ale.'

Offline Bob357

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2023, 05:44:36 pm »
I use dry yeast starters almost all of the time for faster starts and cleaner ferments. I think the old myth not to do starters with dry yeasts evolved from the fact that it was generally cheaper to just use another packet. When using a dry yeast starter, keep in mind that you're, for all intents and purposes, pitching liquid yeast so treat it as such.
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Offline majorvices

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2023, 05:43:49 am »
It's not a "myth."

The problem with making a yeast starter with dry yeast isn't that "you can't do it"; it is the risk of making too small a starter and damaging the yeast. You probably need to start with a 2-gallon starter (1 gallon at the very smallest).

The nice thing about dry yeast is their glycogen reserves are "pre-stored" making them sort of "supercharged." It's the reason why, technically, you can pitch a lower cell count of dry yeast as opposed to liquid yeast.

1 package is probably not going to be enough for a 15G batch, so if you can't afford 2+ or more packages, make a yeast starter. But be sure your starter volume is large enough or you could actually cause the yeast to be less healthy in the starter than they were coming out of the package.

Fire Rooster

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2023, 07:16:34 am »
I personally don't know enough to make an informed decision on this issue.
Hopefully with more input a decisive verdict can be reached.

Following......

Offline BrewBama

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2023, 07:33:00 am »
If the strain you’re using is sold thru Label Peeler’s, they’ll send a pack (or more) with no shipping cost thru the USPS. It takes a week or so but it solves the problem.

Offline majorvices

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #6 on: May 13, 2023, 07:35:04 am »
I personally don't know enough to make an informed decision on this issue.
Hopefully with more input a decisive verdict can be reached.

Following......

What I posted is the "decisive verdict" of dry yeast manufacturers. You can do whatever you want, but the science behind dry yeast is pretty clear.

Offline HopDen

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2023, 07:55:06 am »
"The nice thing about dry yeast is their glycogen reserves are "pre-stored" making them sort of "supercharged." It's the reason why, technically, you can pitch a lower cell count of dry yeast as opposed to liquid yeast".

Correct me if I am mistaken on this, but one would not want to under-pitch a lager yeast, either dry or liquid. Ale yeasts would be fine to under-pitch if you are trying to coax certain characteristics from the yeast.

Offline majorvices

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2023, 08:17:26 am »
"The nice thing about dry yeast is their glycogen reserves are "pre-stored" making them sort of "supercharged." It's the reason why, technically, you can pitch a lower cell count of dry yeast as opposed to liquid yeast".

Correct me if I am mistaken on this, but one would not want to under-pitch a lager yeast, either dry or liquid. Ale yeasts would be fine to under-pitch if you are trying to coax certain characteristics from the yeast.

Pitching rates are only guidelines. The suggested pitching rates are "1 million cells, per milliliter, per degree Plato (about .004-SG)." That rate can go down to as low as 0.35 million cells per milliliter per degree Plato for ales, to as high as 2 million cells per milliliter per degreenPlato for lagers or high-gravity beers.

I'm not sure I'd want to go much lower than the lowest I mentioned above. It depends on a lot of factors. Its always better to over pitch a little than under pitch a lot -- that goes for lager for ales.

Offline majorvices

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #9 on: May 13, 2023, 08:19:55 am »
Apparently the rule is that you don't need to make a starter when using dry yeast ( I never have) but I am shy 1 package. 15 gallon batch. 1.052 OG Need 3 packs but only have 2. Making 2 one liter SNS starters w/11g sachets. Anyone see a possible issue?

I misread your original post. I think you will be fine just pitching what you have. I thought you said you had 1 package for 15 gallons. I think you would be far better just pitching what you have than making a starter.

Offline HopDen

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #10 on: May 13, 2023, 08:33:09 am »
Apparently the rule is that you don't need to make a starter when using dry yeast ( I never have) but I am shy 1 package. 15 gallon batch. 1.052 OG Need 3 packs but only have 2. Making 2 one liter SNS starters w/11g sachets. Anyone see a possible issue?

I misread your original post. I think you will be fine just pitching what you have. I thought you said you had 1 package for 15 gallons. I think you would be far better just pitching what you have than making a starter.

I went ahead and made a 3L starter with the 2 packages. I will add notes to recipe compare with similar others and post what I experienced.

Offline majorvices

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #11 on: May 13, 2023, 08:36:00 am »
As long as you pitch active, I imagine you will be fine. But with a 3L starter with 2 packets of dry yeast, you will have no yeast growth and you will deplete all of the yeast's reserves.

Offline HopDen

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #12 on: May 13, 2023, 08:44:48 am »
As long as you pitch active, I imagine you will be fine. But with a 3L starter with 2 packets of dry yeast, you will have no yeast growth and you will deplete all of the yeast's reserves.

It's still active, about 10 hours in since I made last night. Hopefully there is a short lag time if any at all. Definitely giving the wort a good dose of O2 prior to pitch.

Offline denny

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #13 on: May 13, 2023, 09:04:16 am »
Quote from: Fire Rooster link=topic=39741.msg486737#msg486737 date=1683983794e
I personally don't know enough to make an informed decision on this issue.
Hopefully with more input a decisive verdict can be reached.

Following......

What I posted is the "decisive verdict" of dry yeast manufacturers. You can do whatever you want, but the science behind dry yeast is pretty clear.

Thanks, Keith. That's the science.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline denny

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Re: Dry Yeast Starter
« Reply #14 on: May 13, 2023, 09:05:13 am »
Apparently the rule is that you don't need to make a starter when using dry yeast ( I never have) but I am shy 1 package. 15 gallon batch. 1.052 OG Need 3 packs but only have 2. Making 2 one liter SNS starters w/11g sachets. Anyone see a possible issue?

I misread your original post. I think you will be fine just pitching what you have. I thought you said you had 1 package for 15 gallons. I think you would be far better just pitching what you have than making a starter.

Agreed, at that OG
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell