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Author Topic: My cider has a problem  (Read 1108 times)

Offline Joe_Beer

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My cider has a problem
« on: July 27, 2023, 03:08:19 am »
I racked this off the yeast about a month ago and opened it up this morning to stabilize it. It seems I may have the beginning of a cider sour. Seems to taste OK (on top of the morning coffee anyway), and I might actually go as far as saying it's quite good. Sure looks like one of those pellicle pictures to me. I've not seen everything, but I've yet to see yeast do this.

What's the best way to proceed here?

Offline dmtaylor

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #1 on: July 27, 2023, 05:13:24 am »
That is indeed a pellicle.  Go ahead and stabliize it with sorbate and sulfite, that should kill the pellicle.  My bet is that it turns out good.  Possibly more dry or slightly funky but that looks like a pretty minor pellicle and it's only been there a very short time.
Dave

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Offline Joe_Beer

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #2 on: July 27, 2023, 12:26:38 pm »
Thank you for the insight! I've added the p. meta. today, and usually wait 24 hours to add the p sorbate so will do that tomorrow. I'll give it another taste in a couple days.

Online reverseapachemaster

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2023, 12:57:52 pm »
Definitely a sign of unwelcome visitors. You can't look at a pellicle and know whether that is lactic acid bacteria, wild yeast, or both. Also know way to know what flavor impact the visitors may impart or how quickly. If you're stabilizing, it won't really matter.
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Offline Joe_Beer

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2023, 03:25:26 pm »
Thanks for having a look. Added the P sorb this morning and taste test seems fine which seems weird. I'll backsweeten it in a week and give it another check.

Offline Joe_Beer

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2023, 05:05:11 am »
Tried a taste of it again Friday morning - 2oz maybe - and my guts were in disagreement with this decision most of the weekend. Anyone ever get more than heartburn/flatulence from a funky homebrew? There was a spinach salad and steak involved Friday which are likely culprits too, but still notable.

Offline erockrph

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2023, 10:33:37 am »
Tried a taste of it again Friday morning - 2oz maybe - and my guts were in disagreement with this decision most of the weekend. Anyone ever get more than heartburn/flatulence from a funky homebrew? There was a spinach salad and steak involved Friday which are likely culprits too, but still notable.
I've never gotten ill from funky homebrew, and I'm not inclined to think that it was the cause of your illness. But piece of mind is way more important than a batch of cider. If you are even remotely concerned, just dump it and clean everything really well. You'll never be able to enjoy it if you have nagging doubts about the batch, regardless of whether it was actually gone funky or not.
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Offline Joe_Beer

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2023, 07:05:51 pm »
Nah, I'm going to wait for things to clear up and sample it again.  I've heard of way more cases of gut issues from spinach than homebrew. Besides, if there's something that funky in the cider, I want to know what it is.

Offline fredthecat

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2023, 08:04:55 pm »
i know this is not what people want to hear, but one reason i dont bother with cider anymore is that I made a very small 1 gallon batch of cider from store-bought unpasteurized, as in keep-in-the-fridge and local apple cloudy apple juice. i drank it one night along with a large amount of other alcohol but the day after was either one of my top 3 hangovers ever and/or bodily got sick from it as well. obviously you'd be inclined to think "you just drank a lot" or i ate something bad, but i had the definite perception that it was more of a "i consumed something wrong and im sick" along with a hangover than anything.

people online often recommend trying cider or mead to complete newbies before homebrewing beer, but i always try to tell people homebrewing beer is actually a lot more surefire you will end up with a drinkable product.

Offline Joe_Beer

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #9 on: August 01, 2023, 05:54:38 am »
That sucks. I guess in my case, I can't point at any one thing as a cause. There were just too many variables in between thursday morning and friday evening. fresh fruit, raw greens, handling/cooking raw meat. Could have easily been any one of those.  I have a microscope laying around here somewhere I used for looking at yeast. Not sure I'd be able to see bacteria with it, but I want to put some of that cider under a slide and see what I can see.

Offline denny

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #10 on: August 01, 2023, 08:27:26 am »
I have been making cider from apples I grow, pick, press and ferment myself. Never have I or anyone else been sick from drinking it. You guys are grasping at straws.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2023, 10:10:15 am by denny »
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Offline dmtaylor

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2023, 09:03:54 am »
Spinach is way more likely to cause issues than cider, even funky cider.  Blame the spinach.
Dave

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Offline Skeeter686

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2023, 02:51:03 pm »
Spinach is way more likely to cause issues than cider, even funky cider.  Blame the spinach.
Always blame the spinach!  ;D

Offline fredthecat

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #13 on: August 01, 2023, 04:29:57 pm »
I have been making cider from apples I grow, pick, press and ferment myself. Never have I or anyone else been sick from drinking it. You guys are grasping at straws.

while not discounting that you may/likely/have never made a bad cider, imho it is possible to make a cider that has unwanted bacteria overgrowth in it that continues in or creates toxins that end up in the finished product after fermentation (eventually) takes place. https://www.fda.gov/food/buy-store-serve-safe-food/what-you-need-know-about-juice-safety . wide variation in pH between apple ciders/storage/handling/packaging dates. i am simply describing my experience with a cider i made under crude conditions once.

the key issue here is that there are variables we cant control in some, not all apple juice before we receive it and generally the advice is not to boil it, and that may even be too late if it was unpasteurized and handled/stored poorly at some point in the supply chain.

im no expert, but my key thing i was trying to say was that, for newbies homebrewing extract beer will result in a better product faster than cider or mead.

Offline Joe_Beer

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Re: My cider has a problem
« Reply #14 on: August 02, 2023, 08:17:42 am »
I have been making cider from apples I grow, pick, press and ferment myself. Never have I or anyone else been sick from drinking it. You guys are grasping at straws.

Good to know! Assuming you've had some questionable batches. Ever find out what went sideways and how'd they turn out?