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Author Topic: A couple whole leaf hop questions  (Read 1554 times)

Offline Joe_Beer

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A couple whole leaf hop questions
« on: September 13, 2023, 05:16:07 am »
A buddy gave me some whole leaf hops. Cascade and Willamette. I put all of them on a screen in the basement and dried them out for a week with the dehumidifer running. They are quite dry now.

The Cascade weighs in at 8 ounces. Probably a couple pounds of Willamette.

This chart (https://learningtohomebrew.com/whole-hops-vs-pellet-hops-conversion-calculator/) says dry whole hops are a 1:1 ratio with pellets, which I'm used to brewing with. Does this seem accurate?

I've never used Willamette. Any suggestions?  I like my IPAs and Pale Ales where I don't see Willamette being used.


Offline dmtaylor

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2023, 05:37:09 am »
A lot of calculators assume that you should use an extra 10% whole hops compared to pellet hops.  In reality, you probably don't need to, and can just use the same amount as you would pellets.  It depends of course on the ripeness and alpha acids, but assuming your hops smell awesome and aren't super bright green when picked, they're ripe and you can use them like pellets... but might want to use a hop bag if you didn't before with pellets, as there will be a lot more hop matter.

Willamette hops are beautifully floral, and great for pretty much any styles OTHER than IPA and pale ale.  I use them for lagers and English styles, great for that kind of stuff, also in Belgians.  Time to brew some other styles!
Dave

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Offline pete b

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2023, 06:44:10 am »
Maybe an American pale ale single hopped with the cascade and some british ales with an appropriate pellet hop for bittering wth the Willamette?
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Offline denny

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2023, 08:55:38 am »
Hop drying tip....for better quality,  dry at a higher temp for a shorter time. 135ish F for maybe 3-4 hours works great. It's what the people who grow your hops do.
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Offline Joe_Beer

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2023, 09:12:03 am »
135ish F for maybe 3-4 hours works great. It's what the people who grow your hops do.

Good to know. With the hotter weather we've had the past few weeks I could have dried them in my car  ;)

Thanks all for the tips on the hop bag and other styles. I'll have a look around for some british ale recipes.

The Willamette hops were bright green when I got them, the Cascade was more brown around the edges of the hop leaves. No idea what I was doing so just dried them. How soon do I need to use them? I wouldn't leave a bag of pellet hops sitting open for a week, so not sure how that translates to whole leaf hops when drying, etc.


Offline neuse

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2023, 09:25:07 am »
I've gotten a musty smell from Willamette hops when used in a hop stand at 175F - had that happen twice. Maybe others have tried this and can say if it is a real issue or if maybe I just had some questionable hops. They did smell good in the bag.

Offline denny

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2023, 09:50:04 am »
135ish F for maybe 3-4 hours works great. It's what the people who grow your hops do.

Good to know. With the hotter weather we've had the past few weeks I could have dried them in my car  ;)

Thanks all for the tips on the hop bag and other styles. I'll have a look around for some british ale recipes.

The Willamette hops were bright green when I got them, the Cascade was more brown around the edges of the hop leaves. No idea what I was doing so just dried them. How soon do I need to use them? I wouldn't leave a bag of pellet hops sitting open for a week, so not sure how that translates to whole leaf hops when drying, etc.

You need to use ASAP. They're much more volatile than pellets
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline chinaski

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2023, 10:41:37 am »
You need to use ASAP. They're much more volatile than pellets
I grow my own and once they are dry, I get them into a vacuum sealed bag and they go into the freezer until use.  They stay in good shape this way.

For using them in a recipe for the first time, I recommend using a recipe that will be decent tasting over a range of bitterness- amber ales or altbier are good choices.  I use data from local growers, published ranges from commercially-grown hops, and my own repeated experiences with the varieties that I grow to assign a % alpha acid when designing/adjusting recipes.

Your friend is very generous- it takes a good while to pick that many cones!

Offline Joe_Beer

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2023, 03:24:24 am »
I grow my own and once they are dry, I get them into a vacuum sealed bag and they go into the freezer until use.  They stay in good shape this way.

For using them in a recipe for the first time, I recommend using a recipe that will be decent tasting over a range of bitterness- amber ales or altbier are good choices.  I use data from local growers, published ranges from commercially-grown hops, and my own repeated experiences with the varieties that I grow to assign a % alpha acid when designing/adjusting recipes.

Your friend is very generous- it takes a good while to pick that many cones!

Thanks for the tip! I vacuum sealed them this morning. There wasn't much aroma from them until I started compressing them to get them into a reasonably sized bag. Ok, these might work out.

After getting one ounce into a bag, I can see why pelletizing them is a thing. 

Yep, he's a good egg all around. I had a summer job as a kid picking raspberries for a farm down the road. Picking hops seems like a similar process. I suppose there's machinery to help the big grows, but it's got to be a labor of love growing these things.

Offline erockrph

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2023, 08:27:33 am »
If you want to try out Willamette, I'd recommend a bitter. In particular, I'd use Ron Pattinson's 1957 Whitbread IPA recipe and sub in Willamette for all the hop additions.
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Offline erockrph

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2023, 08:29:12 am »
If you want to try out Willamette, I'd recommend a bitter. In particular, I'd use Ron Pattinson's 1957 Whitbread IPA recipe and sub in Willamette for all the hop additions.
Eric B.

Finally got around to starting a homebrewing blog: The Hop Whisperer

Offline brewthru

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2023, 01:29:26 pm »
Hop drying tip....for better quality,  dry at a higher temp for a shorter time. 135ish F for maybe 3-4 hours works great. It's what the people who grow your hops do.
Denny. Most interesting. Thanks!

Offline denny

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2023, 01:31:51 pm »
Hop drying tip....for better quality,  dry at a higher temp for a shorter time. 135ish F for maybe 3-4 hours works great. It's what the people who grow your hops do.
Denny. Most interesting. Thanks!

Picked that up during many years of visiting hop harvest. When I tried it, my hop quality improved immensely.
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

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Offline brewthru

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2023, 01:55:21 pm »
I'm guessing, only guessing, the longer drying times loses compounds and flavors.

I need to remember this bit of info for the next time I have a hop harvest from my backyard!

Offline denny

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Re: A couple whole leaf hop questions
« Reply #14 on: September 15, 2023, 02:02:21 pm »
I'm guessing, only guessing, the longer drying times loses compounds and flavors.

I need to remember this bit of info for the next time I have a hop harvest from my backyard!

yep
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." - Bertrand Russell