[a10t2]

You go to a McDonalds, a single person usually takes your order, takes your money and fill the sacks with the items you ordered. At rush times they're running around at top speed. Do you tip them? I would guess that's a no for most of us.

Now imagine that the same person puts your food in his car and drives it to your house. And after all that, unless you tip him, he isn't making minimum wage.

I guess maybe some people are under the impression that delivery drivers sit around and eat pizza until an order is ready, then drive somewhere, then come back and sit around some more. Unless they're extraordinarily busy, most pizza places will operate with a manager, a dedicated pizza maker, occasionally one other "insider", and anywhere from 1-10 drivers. When you order pizza, there's a 95% chance that a driver took the order, prepped the ingredients, boxed/bagged the order, and did the dishes.

If you're making the case that who is paid minimum wage and who isn't is arbitrary, I'm right there with you. If you're using that as an excuse not to tip, you're just cheap.

Back off the soapbox...

[dean]

Okay, so FedEx drivers, UPS drivers, the mail person, truckers, etc... I'm sure they would appreciate getting tipped too for delivering in a timely manner as well.    If you contract to have a home built, tip the construction workers well and I'm sure your home will be built "on-time" too.      

Hell, maybe we should all work for tips or consignment?  I bet employers would love that eh?  I wouldn't be suprised to see that happen with our economy the way it is.  

Why don't pizza shops just buy a damn delivery vehicle for their drivers and pay them a decent wage upfront... I'm sure it would be a tax deduction.  In my opinion... its similar to a bait and switch tactic, advertise one price then tack on a "fee".  The advertised price "looks" good or competitive, until the fee is added and then you see the real price the store is charging.  What about people that can't afford the extra tip to the driver?  Should they be denied or have their food spit on the next time they order?    

[a10t2]

What about people that can't afford the extra tip to the driver?  Should they be denied or have their food spit on the next time they order?

That excuse carries no weight with me. Eating out, including delivery, is incredibly expensive. If you're on a budget so tight that a couple dollars make a substantial difference, you should be cooking your own food.

[dean]

I have to add one more thing, I do agree with tipping waiters, pizza drivers, etc.  With the way the current wage system is, they need it in most cases.  Earlier I gave an example where my daughter comp'd a family, which is not unusual where she works and it is at the waiters disgretion... but what I didn't include with that was that the restaurant owner/manager empowered her to do that because it is actually their money that is on the line.  So I don't want anybody thinking all food service management are terrible because its not true.

On the other hand... I see corporate pizza shops more along the line of deceitful and abusing the laws to achieve their own personal gain at the expense of others.  They have no right to any portion of tips.  By automatically attaching a tip to the bill they have taken away something from the customer.... grace.  Now they treat customers like their employees, "demanding".   I don't know about the rest of you, but I like to have the final say whether I tip and how much.  I ate at a great restaurant in Houston quite often, blackeye'd pea if I remember the name right, and I didn't mind the tip being added on, then one day I got this really grouchy and very slow waiter... I had no say in the tip... it pissed me off A Lot because the girl knew she was getting her tip regardless of how she treated us.  The food was great there, I loved it... but that waitress didn't deserve a tip, she deserved to be fired.  

a10t2... do you realize what you just said?  Some people are just getting by and ordering a pizza once a month might be their idea of eatting a prepared meal such as a restaurant.  Just saying.... 

[a10t2]

Wow. I don't think I've ever had anything I've written so thoroughly misunderstood.

If you had bothered to read my earlier posts, you'd find that I do tip. However, I would prefer that they be paid a decent wage for a days work. Yes, they sit around between runs.

In colloquial English, "you" can be used as an indefinite pronoun. In the future I'll use "one" for clarity.

Also, the entire point of my little rant was that drivers are *extremely* busy, all the time, and that very little of the job is the actual driving.

Why is it "okay" for them to provide poor service, if they don't think they'll get a good tip?

I provide non-tipping customers with poor service whenever possible for the simple reason that I LOSE MONEY delivering to them. If there's something I can do that may cause them not to order again, it's in my own interest to do it. Frankly, I don't care if anyone else thinks that's "okay" or not. This isn't a hobby; it's my job. I do it for the money.

I'll bet you take breaks quite often to post here. Maybe you should be tipped for only the time you work.

Tell you what. If you ever see me post between 5 PM and midnight, Thursday through Sunday, I will give you unlimited license to berate me about not doing my job. It's 10:45 on a Thursday morning - since you're posting, may I assume you also work nights?

Better get yourself a soapbox.

I think you may need to look up what that expression means. I was on a soapbox. Then I got off of it. Now I'm on a different soapbox: the one I use to defend myself against ad hominem attacks on the Internet, apparently.

[a10t2]

So please explain how delivery or waiting tables is any different than other job?

The only difference is that a driver or waiter doesn't make minimum wage. As I've said, I think it's a stupid and arbitrary system, but it is what it is, and if you're going to support it by ordering the food, you should be tipping.

A job is a job and you should be compensated for your work, by your employer, and not expect the customers to pay twice. Personally, I would never want to be paid by tips. I would feel cheap.

I certainly agree with you there. I find it incredibly demeaning.

[a10t2]

a10t2... do you realize what you just said?  Some people are just getting by and ordering a pizza once a month might be their idea of eatting a prepared meal such as a restaurant.  Just saying.... 

I sympathize with those people (hell, I *am* one of those people). Would you make the same argument if they went to your daughter's restaurant once a month and didn't tip, though? If so, that's fine - I disagree, but you're certainly entitled to your opinion.

[dean]

I think it all comes down to one thing at least as far as pizza delivery drivers, they used to get tipped very well before tips were imposed into the bill.  I worked technical support at a food equipment manufacturing company and my boss moonlighted as a driver for Pizza Hut because he often made more than $300 a week in tips alone... not anymore.

I do seriously feel for the drivers such as yourself a10t2.  But let me say this with your words, is it right to punish the customer for something management did?

[a10t2]

I think you're misunderstanding me here. I DO tip, and quite generously, because I am aware of the way wait staff is compensated. I just think the concept of having to make tips to earn a decent wage is ridiculous and should be changed.

I didn't misunderstand at all, and in fact I agree with you. I quoted your post initially simply because it provided an example of what my job actually *is* - which is quite different from what most people think it is, in my experience.

[dean]

I was going to say some of the corporate chain pizza joints will probably go out of business before long but then I remembered who owns them.    

[majorvices]

Gotcha.

I'm just glad to have an interesting discussion here without it being blocked or banned. 

Ohhh don't tempt me. 

[a10t2]

But let me say this with your words, is it right to punish the customer for something management did?

Well, I don't see it as punishment. I'm not messing with anyone's food, and I'm always polite and professional. But if I have two deliveries, and I know one of them won't tip (perversely, the people who don't tip are generally the ones who order most frequently) I deliver the other order first, regardless of how old the two orders are. That's a simple cost/benefit analysis, IMHO.

I can't really speak to what tips were like before the companies starting imposing "delivery fees", because I've only been doing this since 2007. But everyone I know in the industry (I've worked in six different stores, for three different companies) is honest with customers about how much of the delivery charge "goes to" the driver. (Drivers were getting a per-delivery supplement before the delivery charges, so it's kind of misleading even to say they "get" some of that money - it's 100% profit for the store.) I think it's exceedingly rare for a tipping customer to have become a non-tipping customer because of the system, though. Some people tip, and some don't - I really believe it's as simple as that.

[a10t2]

I was going to say some of the corporate chain pizza joints will probably go out of business before long but then I remembered who owns them.    

The whole industry is doomed in the long run. It's a ludicrous waste of resources - a 2000+ pound vehicle moving three pounds of food around. Eventually gas will cost enough that consumers won't be willing to pay for it.

[dean]

When they first imposed the "delivery fee", I wouldn't tip the driver the first time because I felt as I said, like I was no longer "allowed to be gracious."  But I did tip again after that and I still do, if, I have it delivered.  Where I live now is too far out so delivery is out of the question, but if they did I would tip very well considering I'm 6+ miles from the store.    

[beerocd]

So, I go to pick up some pizza and the bill is like 13.XX and I give the guy 4 singles and a 20 dollar bill. I should have tipped him for entertainment value. "uh, er, uh hmmm uh you gave me too much!" No, pizza is not cheap around here.... coupon. And 90+ percent of the time we make our own.