[dkfick]

Justin said he's not taking the stage or mic for COTY again. So, that problem is solved. We can stop hammering out that detail.

Justin doesn't control the club anymore than he controlled me entering a couple beers under the club name. I wasnt asked to join, I wasnt asked to participate. 

For the sake of COTY, and under current COTY rules, the BN is a club, regardless of anyone's feelings. Otherwise we wouldn't have won five times in a row.

If you knew anything about it you would know that COTY is an albatross around the BNs neck. Justin and company were hoping to lose so the drama could be pointed elsewhere.

Clubs, real clubs, that want to be awesome clubs and expand their membership and win this award, should stop pouting and do the work to clean up their act and attract people away from things like the BN. No one was forced to choose BN as their club for COTY.

The current importance of COTY rests solely on the people who are making it a big deal. If you want other awards to matter more, spend more time talking about those awards, and when they announce COTY just sit there. Cricket cricket... and dont mention it again. Don't whine that someone else should make it less important for you.

What is this? As you read up on the latest biggest event in homebrewing, 99% of it is about how everyone got screwed out of an award, and how the booing was upseting, and the rooms sucked, and they didn't teach me enough,  and there was a moron in line for an event before AHA, etc etc. A small percentage was about how fun it was and the people are great. Come on people! This is supposed to be fun, supposed to be a hobby, supposed to be a bit of an escape from the daily grind.

Its a good thing my Dad isnt in charge. He'd just cancel the whole thing.

OK I lied... 1 more post... Only because I sent this as a PM earlier.. then it came up again..

I agree it's not against any rules.  Just the spirit of the thing.  Kind of like having a goalie in hockey that is 1500lbs and just blocks the whole net.  Yes there is no rule against the 'wall' goalie... but it would be against the spirit of the game.

[theDarkSide]

So, is the BN a business or a club, or is it both?  The problem isn't that the BN has active membership or that the BN has won several years in a row.  No one is booing the individual brewers that choose to enter under the BN name.  The problem is that the whole conference has turned into a BN marketing campaign.  The first evening event of the week is ticketed BN party, then BN is featured prominently in the exhibition hall selling merch, then BN wins the competition that they happen to be streaming and Justin gets up on stage to further promote the brand (no, not everyone should talk either or the banquet would be too long).  Sure, the GC could change things, but Justin also has influence there.

Did you read the second paragraph on Justin's post?  They get a booth in trade for providing this service to the AHA, which would either have to do it themselves or not at all.  How is the Brewing Network having a booth, selling merch any different from every other vendor in there? 

The BN anniversary party used to be separate, celebrating each anniversary date after the BN started in June 2005.  Once they started doing remotes from the conference, it made sense to do the BNA party during that week, outside the official dates of the conference (last year was a special circumstance).  What about all the other events on Tuesday and Wednesday...should we take them off the AHA site as well?

I disagree with not having everyone speak too.  I wish WHALES and Mark Schoppe (love the helmet by the way) would have said something...it's definitely their time to enjoy. 

And booing during the COTY announcement is booing those brewers who won, even if just by association.    Who would want to go up on stage to accept the award and be boo'd?  Kinda takes the fun out of it.

[klickitat jim]

By the way PTE just won best beer, AGAIN! Feel free to join the BN and read my rant about that over there.

[bboy9000]

Not fair IPA's are always on top because of the sheer number of IPA's in the market.  We should limit the number of IPA's allowed in so a real beer like Tank 7 has a chance to win.

[theDarkSide]

By the way PTE just won best beer, AGAIN! Feel free to join the BN and read my rant about that over there.

I just saw that and said, "Jim must be drinking early today"

[klickitat jim]

By the way PTE just won best beer, AGAIN! Feel free to join the BN and read my rant about that over there.

I just saw that and said, "Jim must be drinking early today"

It's 5o'clock somewhere

[toby]

By the way PTE just won best beer, AGAIN! Feel free to join the BN and read my rant about that over there.

Wish I could, but I'll have to wait until I get home.  I already pointed out the process last night for some Facebook friends.

[Nacho]

Justin said he's not taking the stage or mic for COTY again. So, that problem is solved. We can stop hammering out that detail.

Justin doesn't control the club anymore than he controlled me entering a couple beers under the club name. I wasnt asked to join, I wasnt asked to participate. 

For the sake of COTY, and under current COTY rules, the BN is a club, regardless of anyone's feelings. Otherwise we wouldn't have won five times in a row.

If you knew anything about it you would know that COTY is an albatross around the BNs neck. Justin and company were hoping to lose so the drama could be pointed elsewhere.

Clubs, real clubs, that want to be awesome clubs and expand their membership and win this award, should stop pouting and do the work to clean up their act and attract people away from things like the BN. No one was forced to choose BN as their club for COTY.

The current importance of COTY rests solely on the people who are making it a big deal. If you want other awards to matter more, spend more time talking about those awards, and when they announce COTY just sit there. Cricket cricket... and dont mention it again. Don't whine that someone else should make it less important for you.

What is this? As you read up on the latest biggest event in homebrewing, 99% of it is about how everyone got screwed out of an award, and how the booing was upseting, and the rooms sucked, and they didn't teach me enough,  and there was a moron in line for an event before AHA, etc etc. A small percentage was about how fun it was and the people are great. Come on people! This is supposed to be fun, supposed to be a hobby, supposed to be a bit of an escape from the daily grind.

Its a good thing my Dad isnt in charge. He'd just cancel the whole thing.

OK I lied... 1 more post... Only because I sent this as a PM earlier.. then it came up again..

I agree it's not against any rules.  Just the spirit of the thing.  Kind of like having a goalie in hockey that is 1500lbs and just blocks the whole net.  Yes there is no rule against the 'wall' goalie... but it would be against the spirit of the game.

Are you seriously talking "spirit of things" when you trying to get the BN disqualified as a club? The BN is a 1500# goalie that brews amazing beer.  To say we're not a club is just pure jealousy and it's the typical I didn't win so I'll whine about it and stomp my feet until I get my way.

You want to compete against the BN, I recommend you up your brewing game. Maybe listen to a few brew strong episodes.

[klickitat jim]

I hear footsteps, a moderator walking over to push the locked thread button. Which probably should have happened after reading the title of this thread.

[a10t2]

Some context for those who haven't listened: This thread was mentioned by a caller on Monday's Session podcast on the BN.

[dkfick]

Justin said he's not taking the stage or mic for COTY again. So, that problem is solved. We can stop hammering out that detail.

Justin doesn't control the club anymore than he controlled me entering a couple beers under the club name. I wasnt asked to join, I wasnt asked to participate. 

For the sake of COTY, and under current COTY rules, the BN is a club, regardless of anyone's feelings. Otherwise we wouldn't have won five times in a row.

If you knew anything about it you would know that COTY is an albatross around the BNs neck. Justin and company were hoping to lose so the drama could be pointed elsewhere.

Clubs, real clubs, that want to be awesome clubs and expand their membership and win this award, should stop pouting and do the work to clean up their act and attract people away from things like the BN. No one was forced to choose BN as their club for COTY.

The current importance of COTY rests solely on the people who are making it a big deal. If you want other awards to matter more, spend more time talking about those awards, and when they announce COTY just sit there. Cricket cricket... and dont mention it again. Don't whine that someone else should make it less important for you.

What is this? As you read up on the latest biggest event in homebrewing, 99% of it is about how everyone got screwed out of an award, and how the booing was upseting, and the rooms sucked, and they didn't teach me enough,  and there was a moron in line for an event before AHA, etc etc. A small percentage was about how fun it was and the people are great. Come on people! This is supposed to be fun, supposed to be a hobby, supposed to be a bit of an escape from the daily grind.

Its a good thing my Dad isnt in charge. He'd just cancel the whole thing.

OK I lied... 1 more post... Only because I sent this as a PM earlier.. then it came up again..

I agree it's not against any rules.  Just the spirit of the thing.  Kind of like having a goalie in hockey that is 1500lbs and just blocks the whole net.  Yes there is no rule against the 'wall' goalie... but it would be against the spirit of the game.

Are you seriously talking "spirit of things" when you trying to get the BN disqualified as a club? The BN is a 1500# goalie that brews amazing beer.  To say we're not a club is just pure jealousy and it's the typical I didn't win so I'll whine about it and stomp my feet until I get my way.

You want to compete against the BN, I recommend you up your brewing game. Maybe listen to a few brew strong episodes.

Actually no.  I stated that I didn't see the need to change rules for what is and is not a club.  I only offered my opinion on why people hate the BN calling itself a club....

As to the 'up your brewing game' comment... BN only had 2 medals... To me it's not really relevant though.  I mean I know there are plenty of good brewers that enter under the BN and that don't.  Quality of beer and number of medals are not what my comments were directed towards.

[bboy9000]

Justin said he's not taking the stage or mic for COTY again. So, that problem is solved. We can stop hammering out that detail.

Justin doesn't control the club anymore than he controlled me entering a couple beers under the club name. I wasnt asked to join, I wasnt asked to participate. 

For the sake of COTY, and under current COTY rules, the BN is a club, regardless of anyone's feelings. Otherwise we wouldn't have won five times in a row.

If you knew anything about it you would know that COTY is an albatross around the BNs neck. Justin and company were hoping to lose so the drama could be pointed elsewhere.

Clubs, real clubs, that want to be awesome clubs and expand their membership and win this award, should stop pouting and do the work to clean up their act and attract people away from things like the BN. No one was forced to choose BN as their club for COTY.

The current importance of COTY rests solely on the people who are making it a big deal. If you want other awards to matter more, spend more time talking about those awards, and when they announce COTY just sit there. Cricket cricket... and dont mention it again. Don't whine that someone else should make it less important for you.

What is this? As you read up on the latest biggest event in homebrewing, 99% of it is about how everyone got screwed out of an award, and how the booing was upseting, and the rooms sucked, and they didn't teach me enough,  and there was a moron in line for an event before AHA, etc etc. A small percentage was about how fun it was and the people are great. Come on people! This is supposed to be fun, supposed to be a hobby, supposed to be a bit of an escape from the daily grind.

Its a good thing my Dad isnt in charge. He'd just cancel the whole thing.

OK I lied... 1 more post... Only because I sent this as a PM earlier.. then it came up again..

I agree it's not against any rules.  Just the spirit of the thing.  Kind of like having a goalie in hockey that is 1500lbs and just blocks the whole net.  Yes there is no rule against the 'wall' goalie... but it would be against the spirit of the game.

Are you seriously talking "spirit of things" when you trying to get the BN disqualified as a club? The BN is a 1500# goalie that brews amazing beer.  To say we're not a club is just pure jealousy and it's the typical I didn't win so I'll whine about it and stomp my feet until I get my way.

You want to compete against the BN, I recommend you up your brewing game. Maybe listen to a few brew strong episodes.

Actually no.  I stated that I didn't see the need to change rules for what is and is not a club.  I only offered my opinion on why people hate the BN calling itself a club....

As to the 'up your brewing game' comment... BN only had 2 medals... To me it's not really relevant though.  I mean I know there are plenty of good brewers that enter under the BN and that don't.  Quality of beer and number of medals are not what my comments were directed towards.

But you do want to change the rules so the BN has a harder time winning COTY.

[dkfick]

Justin said he's not taking the stage or mic for COTY again. So, that problem is solved. We can stop hammering out that detail.

Justin doesn't control the club anymore than he controlled me entering a couple beers under the club name. I wasnt asked to join, I wasnt asked to participate. 

For the sake of COTY, and under current COTY rules, the BN is a club, regardless of anyone's feelings. Otherwise we wouldn't have won five times in a row.

If you knew anything about it you would know that COTY is an albatross around the BNs neck. Justin and company were hoping to lose so the drama could be pointed elsewhere.

Clubs, real clubs, that want to be awesome clubs and expand their membership and win this award, should stop pouting and do the work to clean up their act and attract people away from things like the BN. No one was forced to choose BN as their club for COTY.

The current importance of COTY rests solely on the people who are making it a big deal. If you want other awards to matter more, spend more time talking about those awards, and when they announce COTY just sit there. Cricket cricket... and dont mention it again. Don't whine that someone else should make it less important for you.

What is this? As you read up on the latest biggest event in homebrewing, 99% of it is about how everyone got screwed out of an award, and how the booing was upseting, and the rooms sucked, and they didn't teach me enough,  and there was a moron in line for an event before AHA, etc etc. A small percentage was about how fun it was and the people are great. Come on people! This is supposed to be fun, supposed to be a hobby, supposed to be a bit of an escape from the daily grind.

Its a good thing my Dad isnt in charge. He'd just cancel the whole thing.

OK I lied... 1 more post... Only because I sent this as a PM earlier.. then it came up again..

I agree it's not against any rules.  Just the spirit of the thing.  Kind of like having a goalie in hockey that is 1500lbs and just blocks the whole net.  Yes there is no rule against the 'wall' goalie... but it would be against the spirit of the game.

Are you seriously talking "spirit of things" when you trying to get the BN disqualified as a club? The BN is a 1500# goalie that brews amazing beer.  To say we're not a club is just pure jealousy and it's the typical I didn't win so I'll whine about it and stomp my feet until I get my way.

You want to compete against the BN, I recommend you up your brewing game. Maybe listen to a few brew strong episodes.

Actually no.  I stated that I didn't see the need to change rules for what is and is not a club.  I only offered my opinion on why people hate the BN calling itself a club....

As to the 'up your brewing game' comment... BN only had 2 medals... To me it's not really relevant though.  I mean I know there are plenty of good brewers that enter under the BN and that don't.  Quality of beer and number of medals are not what my comments were directed towards.

But you do want to change the rules so the BN has a harder time winning COTY.

I would be in favour of changing the rules so it's actually a worthwhile award.  As to who wins it... I would prefer there was no BN 'club' to even be around to win it, but if there is obviously they would still be I the running for it.

[oldstoneface]

You want to compete against the BN, I recommend you up your brewing game.

If you truly believe that this is the reason the BN won COTY, then clearly you have not been paying attention. The club that other clubs should use as inspiration to "step up their brewing game," is the Austin Zealots who took us all to school in the final round with their awesome medal winning beers.

[Stevie]

Screw it. I belong to two, and half belong to a third, awesome clubs. I live 1800 miles from my "home club" that I would enter under. I normally don't enter because I feel it is a waste of money and effort to pay entry and shipping. Next year I will enter my max under BN Army with my buddy Jim. I might have my wife brew some and enter her max as well.

The BN Army is a club if they want to be a club. They don't need a board, a charter, a constitution, articles of incorporation, dues, or a meeting to be a club. The only requirement to be a club should be a group of brewers that share a common bond and have a desire to be together as one.

I don't think a rule change is needed. If a club wants to win, that club needs to increase their numbers and brew better beer. First round ribbons should count as it took a good beer to get that ribbon. Add a "National Homebrew Competition" to the front of the title and call it a day.