Author Topic: Yeast Nutrient  (Read 10149 times)

Offline bluesman

  • Global Moderator
  • I must live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 8808
  • Delaware
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2011, 11:08:25 AM »
This is the product.

http://www.wyeastlab.com/hb_productdetail.cfm?ProductID=15

I noticed Wyeast recommends dissolving in warm water prior to adding to the kettle. I have always just dropped it in without dissolving. I wonder what difference that would make...or not.  :-\
Ron Price

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 13566
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • View Profile
    • Dennybrew
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2011, 02:02:54 PM »
This is the product.

http://www.wyeastlab.com/hb_productdetail.cfm?ProductID=15

I noticed Wyeast recommends dissolving in warm water prior to adding to the kettle. I have always just dropped it in without dissolving. I wonder what difference that would make...or not.  :-\

Yep, that's what I use.  I admit to not dissolving it, either.  Hey, Tom, you following this?  Any thoughts?
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

Offline tomsawyer

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1694
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2011, 02:27:22 PM »
Wrong "tom" I know, but I add the recommended dosage.  I don't think you want excess nutrient left around after the yeast is done, especially free available nitrogen.  This only provides a more hospitable environment for bacteria.  This is something that is attended to closely by winemakers.  I know the nutrient blend doesn't seem to have much DAP in it but I do believe it has some amino acids.  Plus if theres zinc you might not want a lot of extra of that either.

I think its like taking two vitamins, maybe one thing in there is useful at an elevated concentration but theres other stuff that might be just the opposite.  Since we know you can make good beer without the nutrient to begin with, I wouldn't go with a dose higher than recommended.  They're selling the stuff after all, they have every reason to recommend a higher dose.
Lennie
Hannibal, MO

Offline tschmidlin

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 8195
  • Redmond, WA
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2011, 02:28:46 PM »
This is the product.

http://www.wyeastlab.com/hb_productdetail.cfm?ProductID=15

I noticed Wyeast recommends dissolving in warm water prior to adding to the kettle. I have always just dropped it in without dissolving. I wonder what difference that would make...or not.  :-\

Yep, that's what I use.  I admit to not dissolving it, either.  Hey, Tom, you following this?  Any thoughts?
I read everything :)

I haven't ever experimented with when is best to add nutrients.  For beers I use nutrients in starters and in the boil.  Boiling nutrients can certainly lead to wort darkening, although there is generally plenty of nitrogen in the wort to lead to some darkening.

I use Servomyces, I'm still working through some 10 hl packs I got a while ago :)  I don't know what they use in the Wyeast blend besides the nutrients, but I would think it would be fine just throwing it into the boil.  Maybe it clumps if you throw it in directly, that's the only reason I can think of to dissolve it first.
Tom Schmidlin

Offline tomsawyer

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1694
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2011, 02:44:20 PM »
I've never seen it clump.  I believe the stuff has some yeast hulls, as well as zinc, b vitamin or two (niacin and pantothenic acid?), some little bit of DAP and probably some amino acids from yeast extracts.

I assumed adding it late in the boil was to prevent the destruction of the vitamin(s).
Lennie
Hannibal, MO

Offline denny

  • Administrator
  • Retired with too much time on my hands
  • *****
  • Posts: 13566
  • Noti OR [1991.4, 287.6deg] AR
    • View Profile
    • Dennybrew
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #20 on: December 05, 2011, 03:03:40 PM »
I read everything :)

I haven't ever experimented with when is best to add nutrients.  For beers I use nutrients in starters and in the boil.  Boiling nutrients can certainly lead to wort darkening, although there is generally plenty of nitrogen in the wort to lead to some darkening.

I use Servomyces, I'm still working through some 10 hl packs I got a while ago :)  I don't know what they use in the Wyeast blend besides the nutrients, but I would think it would be fine just throwing it into the boil.  Maybe it clumps if you throw it in directly, that's the only reason I can think of to dissolve it first.

I knew you'd be there!  What about using 1 tsp. per 5 gal. vs. the recommended 1/2 tsp.?  Any advantage?  Any problems?
Life begins at 60.....1.060, that is!

www.dennybrew.com

The best, sharpest, funniest, weirdest and most knowledgable minds in home brewing contribute on the AHA forum. - Alewyfe

Offline bluesman

  • Global Moderator
  • I must live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 8808
  • Delaware
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #21 on: December 05, 2011, 03:24:00 PM »
I have a message out to Wyeast on this Denny. Hopefully they'll get back to me soon. I'll post their reply.
Ron Price

Offline tschmidlin

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 8195
  • Redmond, WA
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #22 on: December 05, 2011, 03:41:28 PM »
I read everything :)

I haven't ever experimented with when is best to add nutrients.  For beers I use nutrients in starters and in the boil.  Boiling nutrients can certainly lead to wort darkening, although there is generally plenty of nitrogen in the wort to lead to some darkening.

I use Servomyces, I'm still working through some 10 hl packs I got a while ago :)  I don't know what they use in the Wyeast blend besides the nutrients, but I would think it would be fine just throwing it into the boil.  Maybe it clumps if you throw it in directly, that's the only reason I can think of to dissolve it first.

I knew you'd be there!  What about using 1 tsp. per 5 gal. vs. the recommended 1/2 tsp.?  Any advantage?  Any problems?
I doubt it makes a noticeable difference either way.  I use it at the recommended dose, but doubling it shouldn't really cause or prevent problems.  I wouldn't worry at all about excess zinc, even at double the level it should all be taken up by the yeast.  The FAN is only marginally more concerning, there isn't likely to be much of that left hanging around either.  There may be a flavor impact at higher rates, I know a guy who swears he can taste nutrient additions in mead.  But it's possible to likely that he's full of crap.
Tom Schmidlin

Offline bo

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1141
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #23 on: December 05, 2011, 03:42:40 PM »
Just throw some dead yeast cells into the boil.

Offline tschmidlin

  • I must live here
  • **********
  • Posts: 8195
  • Redmond, WA
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2011, 03:47:53 PM »
Just throw some dead yeast cells into the boil.
That will give you some benefit, but it's not as complete as the packaged nutrients like you can get from Wyeast.
Tom Schmidlin

Offline tomsawyer

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1694
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #25 on: December 05, 2011, 04:52:42 PM »
I like to throw live yeast in the boil just to hear them scream.
Lennie
Hannibal, MO

Offline bo

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1141
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #26 on: December 05, 2011, 05:47:55 PM »
I like to throw live yeast in the boil just to hear them scream.

I was going say that I use live yeast, but I figured PETY would be all over my ass.

Offline tomsawyer

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1694
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #27 on: December 06, 2011, 09:09:32 AM »
I'm already on their list because of my high fence yeast ranching operation.
Lennie
Hannibal, MO

Offline bluesman

  • Global Moderator
  • I must live here
  • *****
  • Posts: 8808
  • Delaware
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #28 on: December 06, 2011, 06:02:58 PM »
I got a response from Wyeast today in reference to the "increased yeast nutrient" dosage question.

Here's their response:

Ron,
 
If you are brewing an adjunct beer or high gravity beer, it may be relevant to go above the recommended dosage rates. If not, you should be fine with the recommended levels.
 
Please let me know if you have other questions.
 

Jess Caudill
Brewer/Microbiologist
Wyeast Laboratories, Inc.
P.O. Box 146
Odell, OR  97044  USA
Phone:  541-354-1335   Fax:  541-354-3449
jess@wyeastlab.com
www.wyeastlab.co
 

Ron Price

Offline tubercle

  • Senior Brewmaster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1639
  • Sweet Caroline
    • View Profile
Re: Yeast Nutrient
« Reply #29 on: December 06, 2011, 06:27:38 PM »
What would the advantages/disadvantages of a 1-a-day vitamin?
Sweet Caroline where the Sun rises over the deep blue sea and sets somewhere beyond Tennessee